“It's not civilians being bombed and killed, and children being bombed and killed in Gaza. The problem is, we got a punk rock artist saying, ‘Death to the IDF’. That becomes an opportunity to misdirect.”
Touted as Bobby Vylan’s first-in depth interview since Glastonbury, the pair covered a range of topics, including the true meaning of the chant, recent CST figures on antisemitism, and the BBC’s reaction to Vylan’s set.
At one point, Theroux asked Vylan: “What does it mean? Death to the IDF?”
When Vylan threw the questions back to him, Theroux too seemed to dodge them, saying: “I guess my starting point is. I mean, we’ve got very different life experiences. I'm conscious of all the privilege I've enjoyed, which is my long wind up to saying, I was talking to the team about this. Like, I don't think there's any chant that starts with death that I'd be especially comfortable with...”
Bobby Vylan dismissed claims that his Glastonbury set could have contributed to an increase in antisemitism in the UK (Picture: Getty)AFP via Getty Images
At another point, the pair discussed the latest CST statistics on antisemitism in the UK, with Theroux asking: “You know, the other thing to reflect on is it was alleged that after the Glasto set, there was an uptick in antisemitic incidents. Did you see that?”
Vylan replied, “yeah, I saw it” before questioning the validity of the statistics, saying: “What are they counting as antisemitic incidents?”
He went on: “Because I didn't see what they were counting as antisemitic incidents when I read it in The Guardian either. I wonder how you would find that out because in the reporting, no one seemed to press on that quite key detail. What are we claiming is antisemitic?”
Theroux replied: “I do think it's fair to say that there's a lot of nervousness in the Jewish community in general. Is that in your head at all, the possibility of creating an unsafe atmosphere for the Jewish community?”
To which Vylan replied: “Me creating an unsafe atmosphere?
“Yeah, I don't think I have created an unsafe atmosphere for the Jewish community. If there were large numbers of people going out and going like ‘Bob Vylan made me do this’. I might go, oof, I've had a negative impact here. Again, in that report, what definition are they going by? We don’t know that, so it’s kind of hard to add anything to that.”
Near the end of the podcast, Vylan shared his thoughts on Zionism – the Jewish right to self-determination – saying: “Ultimately the fight is against white supremacy, right? Like that is what the fight is against, and I think white supremacy is displayed so vividly in Zionism.”
Responding to the podcast, Leo Pearlman, CEO of entertainment group Fulwell said: “Louis Theroux has every right to interview whoever he wants, but with that right comes responsibility. When you give a microphone to someone who proudly repeats a genocidal chant that played a part in inspiring attacks on Jews across Britain, you’re not probing hate, you’re amplifying it. And don't be fooled, this isn’t journalism exploring the edges of free speech, without meaningful challenge it’s complicity dressed up as curiosity.
"This is what happens when antisemitism becomes fashionable again, when the media treat incitement as an interesting opinion rather than a hate crime. Even when it goosesteps, Jew hate doesn’t always wear a swastika, sometimes it wears a mic and a smirk, and gets invited onto a podcast."
The Louis Theroux Podcast is available on Spotify now.
