The real big society


By Stephen Pollard
February 14, 2011
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Writing about the Big Society (cringe-makingly awful name for an important and good modus operandi), Ben Brogan hits the nail on the head:

[T]he combined might of Labour’s useful idiots in the voluntary and
charitable sector...are neither volunteers nor charitable – they are
paid and their money comes not from individuals but the state. No
wonder they snap any time a hand reaches to turn off the tap.

The other crucial point here was raised yesterday by Nick Clegg in a seemingly unrelated interview in the Observer:

I need to say this – you shouldn’t trust any
government, actually including this one. You should not trust government – full
stop. The natural inclination of government is to hoard power and information;
to accrue power to itself in the name of the public
good.

Quite so.

COMMENTS

amber

Tue, 02/15/2011 - 23:24

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1 point

Millis, I said nothing about moving people eastwards - Jordan, as a Palestinian state, could take control of some of the large Arab population centres. In any case, you show that you misunderstand the word "genocide".

And you say 80% is " as homogeneous as it gets". Rubbish. Every Arab state is almost entirely Arab, and increasingly they are becoming entirely Muslim as well. It seems you are hapopy for any palestinian state to be Judenrein, but it's Ok for Israel to have a large Arab minority.

That's sheer double standards, millis. Come on, you really have made a complete fool of yourself on this blog. Firstly you got in a muddle about "Madatory Palestine", then your hypocrisy about "homogeneous" populations shows.

Sometimes you make sense on these blogs. But then you suddenly decide to employ the most nonsensical arguments to side with Israel's detractors. Why?

You look ridiculous.


Yoni1

Tue, 02/15/2011 - 23:27

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2 points

Sorry to disagree with you, Amber: he IS ridiculous. And deranged (his paranoid schizophrenia about me and Jose being the same person; his antisemitic insults). And stupid and ignorant (doesn't even realise that 75% of the Mandate is east of the river Jordan - or else he is simply lying about it).


amber

Tue, 02/15/2011 - 23:28

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1 point

simonson - try to grasp this fact. The demographics between the Jordan and the Med don't change with a change of borders. Israel has no-one to negotiate with. All that happens is Israel withdraws to indefensible lines, Hamas, with Iranian help, takes control of the PA, rips up any "peace treaty" signed by the now defunct Fatah, starts launching rockets at Jewish Jerusalem and Tel Aviv, Israel responds to stop the rockets, the world condemns Israel for "disproportionality".

Do you see another scenario?


amber

Tue, 02/15/2011 - 23:30

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0 points

Jewish American - please don't bother to hang around. We don't need yet anopther ill-informed self-loathing Israel bashing idiot.


Yoni1

Tue, 02/15/2011 - 23:31

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0 points

Oh, he can loathe himself all he wants: most sensible people, after all, loathe him anyway. It's his loathing for the Jewish nation that's the issue.


jamesmcmann

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 15:38

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-2 points

I haven't the foggiest who's right and who's wrong. It's all terribly complicated. But I am enjoying this thread very much, primarily for Yoni's rhetoric - keep it up! I imagine you pounding away at the keyboard and spit from your be-frothed mouth flecking the screen - most enjoyable.

Keep it up Yoni!

PS - Yoni, please could you call me a stupid 'asshole' / Nazi Jew-hater? It's not true, but I don't want to feel left out.

Thanks!

James x x


jose (not verified)

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 15:44

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1 point

Why did I have that feeling that "jamesmcmann" was a recent subscriber?


Yoni1

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 15:55

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0 points

James, I have no idea whether or not you are an antisemite, but you certainly are a moron.


jamesmcmann

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 15:56

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-1 points

Because I am! Hello Jose.


jamesmcmann

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 16:00

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-6 points

Yes! Thanks Yoni1/Jose! I really feel I've arrived. Are you really both the same person, or do you work as a two man rapid reaction force?


Yoni1

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 16:01

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2 points

Oh sheesh, another utter dumbo who 'thinks' (using the term very loosely) that we may be the same person.


jamesmcmann

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 16:06

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-1 points

Hi Yoni1 - I didn't *think* you were the same person, so I asked. I'm perfectly happy to accept your word as a gentleman that you are not the same person as Jose.

You see, I thought it odd that I should write on a thread where the last comment had been 16 hours before, and in the space of a few seconds both you and Jose had responded. It's a fair enough question to ask, but I'm sorry that it upset you.


Watchful Iris (not verified)

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 16:11

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-2 points

James, have you heard of the city that never sleeps? "Jose" is the blogger who never sleeps.


jamesmcmann

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 16:13

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-1 points

Well, 'nuff respec' (as the young people say) to Jose, then. He's quick on the draw - they both are.


Watchful Iris (not verified)

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 16:16

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-2 points

They have to be. The very existence of Israel depends on it!!!!


jamesmcmann

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 16:18

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-1 points

Yoni1, I'm curious to know - how do you define a "moron"? Do you mean it objectively - that is, to say that I have a mental age between 8 and 12? Or are you using the term subjectively, as a random insult that is intended to wound?


Stanley Walinets

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 19:10

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-2 points

I’ve been away from the screen for a day or two. Now I’m back, and am very pleased to see the debate is continuing. And it’s especially pleasing that most people have been making their contributions in a much more thoughtful and civilised manner. There are still, sadly, a few contributors for whom insults and hysterics are in their view the only way to prove the rightness of their strongly held opinions: but even these have written less offensively.

And that’s a good sign, for this mass of exchanges has shown just how utterly complex the Israeli/Palestinian situation is. The disputes, in this conversation, have mostly been about history. And that’s ok - except historical ‘facts’ can so easily be interpreted differently to fit protagonists’ current beliefs and desires.

Well, debate here has now reached a rather bogged down position. So I’d like to suggest we get back to basics - the situation that Israelis and West Bank Palestinians actually find themselves in today, every day. For none of us can deny the situation is terrible for BOTH peoples and resolution MUST be found, before these two peoples’ situations get even worse. Which CAN happen…

The basics now crying out to be resolved then, are that on one side people feel they’ve been forced out of the homes and land they and their families have lived in for generations. While on the other side people also feel that they too have been forced out - historically -from land they too claim has been theirs for generations.
The main difference between these two sides is that the direct ancestors of the first group actually did live in the homes and areas they were expelled from : whereas many of the other group are immigrants, whose direct ancestors were not born here but live in other countries and still do - though by now numbers of the ‘immigrant’s’ ancestors (i.e. parents and even grandparents) also now live in this country. So the immigrants can only base their claim to the land now on the fact - or belief - that their ancestors lived there many centuries ago.

What can we do?


jose (not verified)

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 19:21

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3 points

I’ve been away from the screen for a day or two. Now I’m back

It started so well, but the end spoils it all, Wallinuts!

For none of us can deny the situation is terrible for BOTH peoples

Well, not so terrible since the security fence is up and running. Let's finish it and establish de facto frontiers since 'Palestinians' seem to love unilateral moves.


jose (not verified)

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 19:37

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2 points

Because I am! Hello Jose.

Why then arrive like a troll and trample on other's feet on you first message?


jose (not verified)

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 19:40

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2 points

"Jose" is the blogger who never sleeps.

And Myopic Iris is the one-neuroner producer of one-liners.

Myopic, considering as you do that I am Yoni1, Jonathan, Jon, Posner, JoseAnth, and so on, I can have five lives.
It surprises me that you couldn't understand that, as it implies activating a single neuron.


Yoni1

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 22:02

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3 points

"I didn't *think* you were the same person"

I didn't say that you did. I said that you thought that we *may* be the same person, which is what your own post was about.


Yoni1

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 22:06

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2 points

"So I’d like to suggest we get back to basics - the situation that Israelis and West Bank Palestinians actually find themselves in today"

Begging the question again, I am afraid, in your usual weasely way. It's the 'WB', rather than its Jewish name of J&S, to people who have already made up their minds that Jews should not live there. It's 'Palestinians' for people who have swallowed the canard that such an ethnic/national group exists.


amber

Wed, 02/16/2011 - 23:57

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0 points

Walinets, please don't bother coming back.

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