Women who libel Israel


By Jonathan Hoffman
October 27, 2012
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http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/women-who-libel-israel.premium-1.472031

By David Landau

Every time Anat Hoffman performs her stunts at the Western Wall, well-meaning liberals like Bradley Burston fall for it.

As a liberal myself (I hope), and as a longtime admirer of Bradley (and in many ways of Anat), I always ask myself, Why? Why participate in a cynical charade designed to portray Israel as a benighted and misogynous backwater?

"Try to imagine this," Bradley begins in his latest fulmination in the wake of Anat's latest provocation. "Try to imagine this in an account of a foreign regime: A Jewish person wearing a prayer shawl is heard publicly chanting the Sh'ma, the core statement of Judaism. The regime's state-funded clerics and its judiciary have ruled that such worship "hurts the feelings" of other people in the area, thus constituting a disturbance of the peace. Police arrest and manhandle the worshipper…"

Well, try to imagine this, Bradley. Try to imagine a Protestant Christian cleric, wearing robes that define his denomination, standing in St Peter's Square, Rome, and leading a group of Protestant Christian coreligionists in a brief prayer service.

It would be brief, because they'd all be carted off by the Swiss Guard quickly enough, for "disturbing the peace".

Now – closer to home for the Hadassah women whose attention Anat was trying to catch – imagine our Protestant doing the same in the forecourt of St Patrick's Cathedral on Fifth Avenue.

Or, even closer, imagine the Satmar Rebbe and a group of his followers marching into New York's Temple Emanu-El and conducting their prayers there. What would your vaunted American Jewish pluralism make of that?

AHA! I hear you say. But this is the WALL we're talking about, the site holy to ALL Jews. Not some single-denominational place of worship. Anat Hoffman and her Women of the Wall want equal, respectful treatment at the Wall.

"It happened at the holiest site of all of Judaism," Bradley explains. "The Kotel, the Western Wall, the last remnant of the ancient Temple, which the Talmud teaches was destroyed by sinat hinam, the baseless hatred of Jews for other Jews."

Fair enough, let's shift the analogy to the site holiest on earth to ALL Christians, the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem.

Now, try to imagine this, Bradley. Imagine a few Copts straying across one flagstone demarcated in the Church of the Holy Sepulchre as the praying territory of the Ethiopians. Imagine a few Armenians encroaching onto one minute of the prayer-time demarcated by ancient accords for the Greek Orthodox. Wars were launched for less.

As for Protestants (the bulk of U.S. Christians), they have no locus standi (in the most literal sense) at all in the ancient Church. They venerate the Garden Tomb, elsewhere in the city. Imagine, Bradley, an American Protestant cleric or layman insisting on conducting a public prayer service (as distinct from private, silent prayer) in the Church of the Holy Sepulchre. The police would have to intervene fast to rescue him or her from the "disturbance of the peace" that would most inexorably ensue.

Where would your sympathies be, by the way, Bradley? Or yours, Anat?

By the same token – and this is really another rhetorical question – where are your sympathies in the matter of Jews, in tallitot like Anat, insisting on declaiming their Sh'ma Yisrael on the Temple Mount, which after all is even holier to Jews than the Western Wall Plaza below?

I know where they are; they're with mine. All three of us liberals see that behavior as wantonly provocative, almost calculated to incite a "disturbance of the peace" in the most literal sense of that phrase, a disturbance that could set the whole Middle East ablaze.

Perhaps the best analogy to the Wall is London’s Westminster Abbey, the foremost national shrine that is also the foremost place of worship of a state that has a state-religion, Church of England Protestantism.

The Catholics, long persecuted in the past, have their own Westminster Cathedral nearby. The Jews, long discriminated against, too, have their synagogues. The Muslims their mosques, and so on.

There is pluralism and freedom of religion in Britain. Everyone can visit every house of worship, respectfully. But they cannot – even if they are devout and pious Christians – conduct any Christian divine service in Westminster Abbey other than the service of the state-religion: Church of England. To do so would entail being arrested and manhandled, as Anat was and hoped and intended to be, when she conducted an act of Jewish worship at the Western Wall that diverged from the rite of the state-religion of Israel: Orthodox Judaism.

Non-Orthodox Jews in the U.S. and elsewhere may understandably balk and bridle at the assertion that Orthodox Judaism is Israel’s state-religion. But it is plain silly for Bradley Burston to deny what is a manifest truth, and to moan and mourn at the blithe indifference of the Israeli press and public to Anat Hoffman's antics.

The State of Israel, a product of European political culture, has a state-religion. American Jews – and Israelis playing to their gallery like Anat – need to understand and accept that, just as Europeans – and Israelis – understand that their constitutional conventions are deeply different from America’s political culture. Just as the Women of the Wall would accept and respect the rules in Westminster Abbey, and surely not sympathize with Methodists or Mormons trying to muscle in and hold a service there.

Israel's formative political culture is not necessarily immutable. As Golda Meir, that American-educated yet benighted and misogynous Israeli head of government (America has yet to elect one), never tired of explaining and repeating: If non-Orthodox American Jews want to influence the issue of synagogue-and-state in Israel, they need to live here in sizable numbers and vote here.

Decades later, that remains demographic, democratic, common-sense.

COMMENTS

Real Real Zionist

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 10:07

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What unmitigated tosh. A stream of ludicrous false analogies.

" I am grateful to David Landau. His attack on Women of the Wall was so outrageous, so absurd and misinformed that it can only increase support for the values and the causes that these women advocate. Landau,a smart and usually careful journalist, got just about everything wrong."

Rabbi Eric Yoffie.


happygoldfish

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 10:42

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Jonathan Hoffman: … the site holiest on earth to ALL Christians, the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem …

a detailed 1929 report on the ottoman and british "status quo" legislation on the christian/christian disputes at that church, introduced by the chief secretary to the government of palestine, can be read at http://www.usahm.info/Dokumente/STATUSQUO.htm

(btw, it also deals with the jewish/moslem disputes over the wailing wall and rachel's tomb)

and, from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brotherhood_of_the_Holy_Sepulchre#Breaches_...

The establishment of the status quo did not halt the violence, which continues to break out every so often even in modern times. For example …


Advis3r

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 11:30

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Eric Yoffie - absurd misinformed and certainly no "Rabbi".


Advis3r

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 11:39

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"The Kotel, the Western Wall, the last remnant of the ancient Temple, which the Talmud teaches was destroyed by sinat hinam, the baseless hatred of Jews for other Jews" a good lesson for Mr Yoffie to heed.

I would submit that Anat Hoffman is the one displaying baseless hatred for her fellow Jews. What she practices is not Judaism because authentic Judaism prescribes the separation of the sexes.

The Holy Temple had a a section called "Ezrat Nashim"The women's courtyard. If the good Mr Yoffie was informed he would know that originally, the women assembled in the courtyard and the men danced and sang outside, beyond the Cheil. This was to enable the women to view the Simchat Bet Hasho'eva (Rejoicing of the Water Drawing Ceremony) which was held in this courtyard during the festival of Succot

Since the women were unable to have a good view from inside the Women's Courtyard, they would pass beyond the doors into the area. The mingling of men and women during a sacred celebration is not permitted. To remedy the situation, balconies were erected to provide a viewing area for the women.

Ms Anat Hoffman however obviously hates religious Jews that is why she provokes hatred by doing what she knows is not permitted. She will not succeed.


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 11:44

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I am shocked and appalled that the former co-vice-chair of the Zionist Federation should cite David Landau, a misogynist who called for Israel to be raped. Maybe that's why he is "former".
And if anyone can be held responsible responsible for sinaat chinaam, it's the ultra nationalists and Orthodox (and especially the combination of both) who spread hatred all the time.


Real Real Zionist

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 12:39

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Hate to be nit picky because these observations are not really relevant to the issue which is medieval attitudes to women but......

a) Orthodox Judaism is NOT the state religion of Israel, nor in fact is Judaism.

b) the western wall is not in Israel.


Mary in Brighton

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 12:51

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How strange that Jonathan thinks that women praying is a libel on Israel.


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 14:27

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Millis
Seriously , isn't it time you dropped this vendetta against JH . Every time you post you refer to his ZF status . What is it with you ?
You tried to stir up trouble for him at work in order to get him dismissed and got nowhere . Ironically you ended up being quietly let go by UJIA after a remarkably short employment .
Time to quit with your animus towards JH . Let it go . You will be much better for it .


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 14:43

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Mary
I realise you don' t understand the complexities of Judaism .
As a secular Jew , I don't profess to know it all either . However I know enough to understand that there is a time and place for everything and standing in the middle of the male ultra Orthodox section at the Kotel is neither time or place. It is however a highly provocative action designed to cause maximum insult, and in truth has little to do with strict religious observation and everything to do with radical feminist action.

As the article points out , it is no different from staging a Catholic Mass at Westminster Abbey and vice versa . It's just not Kosher .


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 14:47

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The fact that he no longer blogs on tax payers' - your taxes and mine - time is a victory. That is all was ever needed, as his bosses know.
Who's been let go? News to me, bub.
But it's great that he has to cite Landau who called on Israel to be raped. Shows both Landau's and the ZFs former co-vice-chair's attitude to women. And they weren't in the men's section, they were in the women's section, wearing women's talitot which even the Israeli police have deemed legal. They were reciting the shema. Which is also legal.


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 14:59

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RRZ
The Western Wall is part of the Jewish quarter of the Old City . The Jewish quarter was included with West Jerusalem as part of the 1947 UN partition plan accepted by Israel and rejected by the Arab states .
It was captured by the Arab Legion in the War of Independence and East Jerusalem and the West Bank was annexed by Jordan shortly after . Following its capture , some 60 Synagogues , schools and community centres were either destroyed or desecrated with Jewish tomb stones from the Mount of Olives used for paving stones . Jews were unable to access the Kotel despite it being agreed as part of the UN armistice following the war .

East Jerusalem including the Jewish Quarter was recaptured during the 67 6 Day War with full protected access for all religions and denominations .


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 15:40

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As you can see from his postings, Mr Hoffman is an ill-mannered, angry man, who does the reputation of the Greater London Authority no service at all. I would like to know how you intend to discipline Mr Hoffman to prevent him continuing his spiteful and vicious campaign against innocent people. “

Millis

The above is an extract from your letter which Jonathan has kindly allowed me to be privy to following resolution of your complaint

Note :Your letter does not restrict itself to concerns over JH s personal use of IT facilities during office hours . Indeed you would have had no idea what usage would have been acceptable to his employers .

Instead your letter calls for a blanket disciplinary measure by JH s employers with all that entails .

In truth you had no interest in tax payer accountability . You saw this as an opportunity to make problems at work for JH even to the point of getting him dismissed with no thought regarding the impact on his life and family .

Not even the BDS campaigners thought that one up .

How despicable, to spread sinat chinam to an employer of an israel advocate with whom you disagree.

You should swallow your pride ,acknowledge your mistake and make a full and frank public apology . It would be the right thing to do


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 15:42

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Did someone say segregation?

And

Following its capture , some 60 Synagogues , schools and community centres were either destroyed or desecrated with Jewish tomb stones from the Mount of Olives used for paving stones .

There used also to be a Muslim cemetery in Malcha. Its tombstones are now part of the mall there. And there was also a Muslim one in Mamilla. Its stones are part of the foundation of the rich peoples' summer houses there.
No one's hands are exactly clean.


Mary in Brighton

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 15:43

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I know my place.


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 16:15

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You are being economical with the truth Joe . As you well know , the Courts have acted on an Injunction and its all on hold . As it happens , part of the cemetery you refer to was turned into a car park by the Muslim authority . Anyway see below .

'The protest has left the construction indefinitely stalled, which may be of benefit to historically minded Jerusalemites; while the Museum of Tolerance languishes, visitors can still wander among the mausoleums and headstones of the Mamilla cemetery for a closeup look of a bygone era in Jerusalem.'


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 16:20

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You are being economical with the truth Joe . As you well know , the Courts have acted on an Injunction and its all on hold . As it happens , part of the cemetery you refer to was turned into a car park by the Muslim authority . Anyway see below .
'The protest has left the construction indefinitely stalled, which may be of benefit to historically minded Jerusalemites; while the Museum of Tolerance languishes, visitors can still wander among the mausoleums and headstones of the Mamilla cemetery for a closeup look of a bygone era in Jerusalem.'

Read again. I am not talking about the Museum of "Tolerance". I know it's in the court's hands; that's why I didn't mention it. I was referring to Malcha (Manchat) and Mamilla.


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 16:23

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Harvey

Reading comprehension, please.

As you can see from his postings, Mr Hoffman is an ill-mannered, angry man, who does the reputation of the Greater London Authority no service at all. I would like to know how you intend to discipline Mr Hoffman to prevent him continuing his spiteful and vicious campaign against innocent people. “

Any call here for his removal? No. Just for him to be disciplined (and not a blanket one) which apparently he has - and he hasn't even got the gumption )or permission) to post this himself, preferring instead to send a crony to post on his behalf during office hours. In other words, he's had his work time blogging rights removed.

Indeed you would have had no idea what usage would have been acceptable to his employers .

As evidenced by his lack of posting during office hours blogging on company time and therefore on the tax payer's shilling - was not part of his T&Cs.

Not even the BDS campaigners thought that one up .
How despicable, to spread sinat chinam to an employer of an israel advocate with whom you disagree.

After the hate filled splenetics and infighting he's created and spread over the years - including being cited as a hero in a vile hate letter to your's truly (in the Met's hands with good news) it's the very least I could do. Glad to have been of service. If anyone should apologise for sinaat chinam, it's him.
More evidence of sinaat chinam can be seen in this posting when he cuts and pastes, in its entirety, a column by someone who called for Israel to be raped. Can the depths of depravity be plumbed any further?


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 16:36

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Millis
Once you sent that letter , it was out of your hands .
You had no idea where disciplinary proceedings would lead . It could have meant a slap on the wrist , or it could have resulted in his dismissal . I have no doubt you would have been most content to see the latter course of action .
If otherwise why did you not soften the tone of the letter and simply request that JH use of personal IT time be restricted to lunch breaks . There is no such request .
You called for disciplinary action to be implemented .
Nothing less .
So cut the BS , we know your intentions and more importantly so do you .
You were vexed by JH opinions which differ manifestly from yours and you sought to ' shut him down ' even if it meant getting him fired .
That's despicable by anyones standards let alone a ' proud and true Zionist as you claim .
So here and now do the honourable thing , apologise let bygones be bygones and strike a fresh note . People would think highly of such a gesture and it would go a long way to redeeming yourself .


Mary in Brighton

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 16:39

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You do seem to be a bit of a glove puppet Harvey.


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 16:41

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Not a butterball's chance in hell will I apologise to someone who spread so much hatred and did so much damage to Israel's cause. What goes around comes around - look what happened at the ZF yesterday.
So despite you quoting selectively from the email, I wanted him disciplined to have him lose his blogging rights on the tax-payer's shilling. He was. End of.


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:07

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That's a shame . It takes a big person to acknowledge the error of his ways .

Mary
Think you mean a sock puppet . Personally Id like to think of myself as one of the three musketeers ( you know the other two ) with Joe playing the part of Cardinal Richelieu .
Really Im just about mending fences if you get my drift .


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:13

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Anyway Joe ,Jonathan was easily elected to his preferred BOD division. You failed completely to be elected to yours. I rest my case .


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:15

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So I shan't ( accompanied by stamp of foot )


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:20

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He's been a BoD member for yonks (too long perhaps). No wonder he was elected (and he had to shift divisions to do that. He would not have got onto the International division). I'm in my first term as a rep. I never expected to be elected. And to what, precisely, have you been elected, Harvs?


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:20

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That's a shame . It takes a big person to acknowledge the error of his ways .

If my ways were erroneous, I would. But they aren't, so I shan't (it's called rhyming). So where's Hoffman's acknowledgement that he spread hatred, infighting and division? Can you get him to let you post that?
Richelieu, eh? The man who prevented the Hapsburgs from taking over Europe, who sought alliances with the Protestants and was a huge patron of the arts and culture. I am flattered.


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:22

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If my ways were erroneous, I would. But they aren't, so I shan't. So where's Hoffman's acknowledgement that he spread hatred, infighting and division? Can you get him to let you post that?

I would if he did but he didn't so I won't .
Anyway get your own second . I hear Mary has space in her hectic schedule .


Mary in Brighton

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:26

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Lol Harvey I don't do hectic

What did happen at the ZF yesterday ?


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:29

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And to what, precisely, have you been elected, Harvs?

The three Musketeers . I play Porthos .
Honest, gullible ,extrovert and extremely loyal with a penchant for wine women and song . Order interchangeable depending on circumstances .


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:30

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Oh, but he did. And often. So please get the organ grinder to post you his apology.
Mr Hoffman is no longer ZF co-vice-chair after yesterday. Not sure if he jumped or was pushed or whether he jumped before he was pushed. Still, it's great news for sensible Zionists in this country.
Harvey, the scare-mongers' time has passed. Thankfully


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:31

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No idea Mary . Thought you knew .


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:36

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Joe
Do lighten up a bit! It could be worse . You could still be with UJIA
What's with all this probationary period anyway . Seems like a means for all concerned to come out of it smelling of roses .


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:41

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Still Am. Time to poison minds again, Harvs. Toodle pip.


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 17:55

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Even wrong on the Richelieu reference

The novel, depicts Richelieu as a power-hungry, unscrupulous, and avaricious minister.

Sounds about right .


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 18:15

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Novel? As in fiction? Jeez. You are relying on Dumas as a source? According to the leading expert on the subject, James Collins, in The State in Early Modern France (Cambridge University Press), Richelieu's tenure was, in summary, a critical reforming era in France. He was largely responsible for centalising the former Feudal political structure where powerful nobles enacted a wide variety of laws in different regions.. Under him, and despite him being a cardinal, even religious interests were subordinated to those of the "state". He helped restrain Habsburg influence in Europe and led to the decline of the Holy Roman Empire (which wasn't holy, Roman or an empire as such).
I think he's due a huge round of applause. And don't forget Dumas was a crony of the nobilité.
Why do you make it so easy for me?


Real Real Zionist

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 18:22

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ok well lets all lighten up here. We have a pot kettle scenario of gigantuan proortions. Harv were you not heavily involved in the futile attempt to get Joe Millis dumped from his job ? Were you not supportive of Hoff's endless vendettas against members of the community that dissented from your political position ? People that were solution oriented rather than wholly obsessed with self promotion ?

So the ZF has elected for, if not respectability, at least for something resembling sanity. Harv you talk of mending fences.I am going to assume you are sincere ( I know,I know I am too good for this world ).

So no more vendettas against solution orientated members of the community ? No more of this ? Is this over ? Confer with your lunatic fringe masters. You know where to contact me.


Harvey

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 18:55

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Totally subjective Millis and open to interpretation .


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 19:22

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Anyway, back to the main point. Jonathan Hoffman is citing - actually cutting and pasting - a column by David Landau who urged the US to rape Israel in order to get it to sign a peace deal. I cannot think of anything more depraved than urging a rape.

And no, Harvey, it's a novel, a work of fiction. You'll be telling me next that Henry V actually did give the St Crispin's Day Speech à la Shakespeare.

This day is called the feast of Crispian:
He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
Will stand a tip-toe when the day is named,
And rouse him at the name of Crispian.
He that shall live this day, and see old age,
Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
And say 'To-morrow is Saint Crispian:'
Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars.
And say 'These wounds I had on Crispin's day.'
Old men forget: yet all shall be forgot,
But he'll remember with advantages
What feats he did that day: then shall our names.
Familiar in his mouth as household words
Harry the king, Bedford and Exeter,
Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester,
Be in their flowing cups freshly remember'd.
This story shall the good man teach his son;
And Crispin Crispian shall ne'er go by,
From this day to the ending of the world,
But we in it shall be remember'd;
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition:
And gentlemen in England now a-bed
Shall think themselves accursed they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.

Holding your manhood cheap, Harvey?

Or perhaps he really did give this bravura peroration at Harfleur.

Once more unto the breach, dear friends, once more;
Or close the wall up with our English dead.
In peace there's nothing so becomes a man
As modest stillness and humility:
But when the blast of war blows in our ears,
Then imitate the action of the tiger;
Stiffen the sinews, summon up the blood,
Disguise fair nature with hard-favour'd rage;
Then lend the eye a terrible aspect;
Let pry through the portage of the head
Like the brass cannon; let the brow o'erwhelm it
As fearfully as doth a galled rock
O'erhang and jutty his confounded base,
Swill'd with the wild and wasteful ocean.
Now set the teeth and stretch the nostril wide,
Hold hard the breath and bend up every spirit
To his full height. On, on, you noblest English.
Whose blood is fet from fathers of war-proof!
Fathers that, like so many Alexanders,
Have in these parts from morn till even fought
And sheathed their swords for lack of argument:
Dishonour not your mothers; now attest
That those whom you call'd fathers did beget you.
Be copy now to men of grosser blood,
And teach them how to war. And you, good yeoman,
Whose limbs were made in England, show us here
The mettle of your pasture; let us swear
That you are worth your breeding; which I doubt not;
For there is none of you so mean and base,
That hath not noble lustre in your eyes.
I see you stand like greyhounds in the slips,
Straining upon the start. The game's afoot:
Follow your spirit, and upon this charge
Cry 'God for Harry, England, and Saint George!'

And Orwell's 1984 is an accurate depiction of what happened in 1984.


happygoldfish

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 19:39

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Harvey: Following its capture , some 60 Synagogues , schools and community centres were either destroyed or desecrated with Jewish tomb stones from the Mount of Olives used for paving stones . Jews were unable to access the Kotel despite it being agreed as part of the UN armistice following the war .

joemillis1959: There used also to be a Muslim cemetery in Malcha. Its tombstones are now part of the mall there. And there was also a Muslim one in Mamilla. Its stones are part of the foundation of the rich peoples' summer houses there.
No one's hands are exactly clean.

joe, even if tombstones have been used to make a mall, or foundations for summer houses … which seems unlikely, and for which there doesn't appear to be any evidence

it's a rather ineffectual smoke-screen to try to put that on a par with the destruction of synagogues and communal buildings, and refusal of access to judaism's holiest site


joemillis1959

Mon, 10/29/2012 - 19:45

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I'm just saying that both sides' hands are not clean when it comes to Jerusalem.

And to destroy a cemetery is on a par with destroying synagogues. Unless, of course, you take a somewhat racist view, which I suspect you don't.

Israel also imposes closures on Temple Mount when it wants, thus restricting access to a holy site.


Jonathan Hoffman

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 10:05

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The words 'despicable' and 'contemptible' are wholly inadequate to describe someone who attempts (unsuccessfully btw) to censor an Israel Advocate by depriving him of his livelihood.


Jonathan Hoffman

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 10:21

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The words 'despicable' and 'contemptible' are wholly inadequate to describe someone who attempts (unsuccessfully btw) to censor an Israel Advocate by depriving him of his livelihood.


happygoldfish

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 10:44

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happygoldfish: joe, even if tombstones have been used to make a mall, or foundations for summer houses … which seems unlikely, and for which there doesn't appear to be any evidence …

so you accept that there is no evidence that that is true?

joemillis1959

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 10:53

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There is evidence, just go to Jerusalem to the malcha area and mamilla and check.


zaheerayin

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 10:54

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"The words 'despicable' and 'contemptible' are wholly inadequate to describe someone who attempts (unsuccessfully btw) to censor an Israel Advocate by depriving him of his livelihood."

Stealing time or money from the taxpayer is despicable and contemptible, not the reporting of it. You seem to have your values twisted around. They think that(your)way in prison, btw. It's always the whistle blower's fault for blowing the whistle, not the criminal's for doing the crime.

You're not entitled to waste the taxpayer's shilling while pursuing your own interests. Where you got the idea you were, is beyond me.

At least that damn election is over.


zaheerayin

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 11:01

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Harvey, if Isi Liebler is your source, there's a bridge in Arizona you might want to buy.


Mary in Brighton

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 11:07

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Screw the taxpayer!


joemillis1959

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 12:21

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The organ grinder's organ grinder speaks. No one tried to censor you so don't play the martyr or the victim. That's what the other lot do. You aren't blogging on the tax payer's shilling anymore, and for that we London tax payers can only give thanks. That's all that was necessary despite pathetic attempts by your cronies to say otherwise.
So why did you cut and paste a column by someone who called for Israel to be raped, showing his attitude towards both Israel and women? Now that's what I call plumbing the depths of depravity. Israel advocate? I and many others don't think so and are grateful that you no longer have official status to spout your divisive hate mongering and spread infighting.


joemillis1959

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 12:23

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0 points

Actually, Jonathan, I've gone from complete contempt for you and your ways, which are linked on so many levels, to feeling somewhat sympathetic - if not empathetic.
You really need to get some help, man. Depression is so debilitating. I speak from experience.


happygoldfish

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 12:23

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2 points

joemillis1959: There is evidence, just go to Jerusalem to the malcha area and mamilla and check.

you mean, you've been to jerusalem and seen tombstones in the malcha mall, and seen tombstones in the foundations of summerhouses?

joemillis1959

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 12:32

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0 points

No, silly, seen evidence of them at Malcha. Know that when they built the rich persons' sumer homes in Mamila, they used the rubble of the old houses and other facilities in the area for foundations.
There are similar incidences in those villages in what is now Tel Aviv (why do you think they chose to build Tel Aviv where they did? Because they saw that the villages there had water sources.)
But, hey, à la guerre comme à la guerre etc…

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