Justin Bieber and Anne Frank: Why the fuss?


By Jennifer Lipman
April 15, 2013
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Dear Kitty (as Anne Frank never wrote),

"I'm soo sick of being stuck in hiding, because my dad keeps telling me to turn down the volume on my Justin Bieber CD. If only I could get out to go and see him on tour…"

Clearly, Anne– the teenage diarist forced into hiding by the Nazis, who eventually died at Bergen Belsen – had more serious considerations than the average 21st century western teenager. In her diary, perhaps one of the most well-known examples of Holocaust-era testimony, she wrote of an everyday existence blighted by fear, death and hatred.

How tragic, knowing what became of her, to read her words: "Although I'm only fourteen, I know quite well what I want, I know who is right and who is wrong. I have my opinions, my own ideas and principles."

Yet those who have read Anne's diary will recall that, for all that her life was unlike many young people then and since, she was in many ways a typical teenager - frustrated by her mother, confused about boys. She could be petulant, she could be irrational. In another life, it's not a stretch to imagine she might have been – as Bieber claimed this week – a fan of some fairly atrocious music. One of the many tragedies of her story is that she never got the chance to be embarrassed by her teenage passions.

Bieber is facing opprobrium for writing in the Anne Frank House guestbook that "Anne was a great girl. Hopefully she would have been a belieber."

The correct response to a tale of persecution - to wonder whether the victim would have liked your latest video? Not to most of us, attuned to the sensitivities of discussing the Holocaust. As Karen Pollock, chief executive of the Holocaust Educational Trust, noted, his message left her "a bit lost for words".

Gillian Walnes, co-founder of the Anne Frank Trust UK, issued a sterner rebuke. "This is a place where Anne Frank spent two years," she said. "Now 70 years later a pop singer is trying to hijack this for his own self-aggrandisement."

She has a point, not least that Justin Bieber didn't reach stratospheric levels of success without being a shameless self-publicist. If his visit had been purely a visit – rather than, at least in part, a publicity stunt – we wouldn't even have heard about it.

Of course it trivialises the Holocaust to talk about whether one of its most famous victims would have been a fan of a singer with ridiculous hair; far more crucial to reflect on the piles of human hair, seized by the Nazis from their helpless victims, preserved at Auschwitz and other concentration camps. Of course the legacy of a girl who died before her 16th birthday for no other reason than being born a Jew, deserves more than contemplation as to how she would have spent her weekends if they'd been hers to spend.

Yet look on almost every news site around today. Yes, there are headlines about Bieber. But there are also headlines about Anne Frank, and the Holocaust – articles that his mostly tween fanbase would be unlikely to peruse without Bieber's photograph accompanying them. Anne is even a trending topic on Twitter.

And it matters. It matters because in 2009 a survey revealed that one in 20 British kids thought Hitler was a football coach, and because in a decade, there won't even be survivors left to talk to them at schools, or grandparents around to share their memories. It matters because when Baroness Thatcher died, the interest of a confused generation was piqued mainly by a tweet from Harry Styles. It matters because children listen far more to their role-models than they do to well-meaning teachers.

We can lament that as a sign of a generation brought up on reality TV and 140 characters of trash, or we can see it as an opportunity, and look to these "stars", with their poor spelling and ignorant remarks, and recruit them to spread the word about important issues. They'll do it if it gives them good publicity; teachers and organisations should seize on that.

We'll never know whether Anne Frank would have been a "belieber" and, if we had the chance, I'd hope it wouldn't be the first question we'd put to her. But if even one 14-year-old asks his parents or teachers today about why she lived in an attic, or reads her moving diary, then we'll have Justin Bieber and his ridiculous remark to thank.

COMMENTS

Advis3r

Wed, 08/07/2013 - 09:27

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The BDS Movement’s tactics are clear: if we don't get our way by bullying, threatening, or intimidation we just plain lie; the symbol of abject failure.


Harvey

Wed, 08/07/2013 - 09:51

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Latest jaw dropper from our mole in the BoD

https://mobile.twitter.com/joemillis1959/status/364722451877347330

# Israel not central to Judaism # atavistic enterprise
# shillin for the enemy


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/07/2013 - 10:34

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Harvs, I'm touched that you and the judean people's front feel the need to spread further what I write. One question, though, do you know what atavistic means? Without consulting a dictionary?

I hope too you'll unload wot I rote about the JLC merger and the attacks on Arse-nal amd Chavski


Rich Armbach

Wed, 08/07/2013 - 11:47

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h


Harvey

Wed, 08/07/2013 - 14:32

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Joe
Fess up . Who is fronting the 30 pieces ?


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/07/2013 - 14:50

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Zionist Federation/YadbeYad, Stand with Us, the Britain Israel Coalition and the JNF, Harva'le.

Didn't know you were into Christian theology. Mind you it figures after unapologetically standing with neo-nazi thugs.


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/07/2013 - 16:28

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Yes, Rich, Dougie Murray is an apologist for the EDL. He was on Sunday live the week before last and wouldn't condemn them. He is a bit mealy mouthed about the BNP. But that's because they don't hide their hatred of gays like the EDL.


zaheerayin

Mon, 08/12/2013 - 09:13

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Looks like Mr. Pollard forgot to collect the office key when Happy Lipman left.


Harvey

Tue, 08/13/2013 - 13:32

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A list of Those about to be returned to Palestinian society in order to enrich that society .
Get ready to hand out the sweets

This is a cross post from CIFWatch

The following is a list of the 26 prisoners scheduled for early release from prisons in Israel later this week as a ‘goodwill gesture’ to encourage Palestinian leaders to return to the negotiating table. In all, Israel agreed to eventually release 104 so-called pre-Oslo prisoners.

As we have noted, many in the media (including the Guardian, The Independent, and the Irish Times,) have whitewashed the violent, and often brutal crimes of the prisoners being released, and, conversely, have depicted the families of the soon-to-be released prisoners in a disturbingly sympathetic light. So, in addition to listing details about the perpetrators, we’ve also included some information on the victims. (You can see the complete list of pre-Oslo prisoners – information which was translated, edited and published exclusively by CAMERA – here.)

1. Kour Matwa Hamed Faiz (Fatah. Born 1964, resident of Judea & Samaria, arrested 1985) was sentenced to one life term for his part in establishing an armed Fatah cell and for the murder ofMenahem Dadon in 1983 and for another attempted murder.

Menahem Dadon from Netivot was 22 years old when he was murdered. He had been sent by his employer to purchase building materials in Gaza and whilst in the shop, was shot in the head at point-blank range. He left a pregnant wife and two daughters.

2. Tsalah Ibrahim Ahmed Mugdad (Fatah. Born 1966, resident of Judea & Samaria, arrested 1993) was sentenced to 32 years imprisonment for the murder of Israel Tennenbaum and was due to be released on 13/6/2025.

Born in Poland in 1921, Israel Tennenbaum from Moshav Vered was a farmer who also worked as a security guard at a hotel in Netanya despite being 72 years old at the time of his death. In June 1993 Tsalah broke into the hotel and murdered Israel Tennenbaum by beating him over the head with a steel rod. He also stole a television from the hotel.

3. Na’anish Naif Abdel Jafar Samir (Born 1967, resident of Judea & Samaria, arrested 1989) was sentenced to a life term for his part in the murder of 24 year-old reservist Binyamin Meisner in February 1989.

Na’anish was part of a group which lured Meisner into an ally in Nablus (Schem) in which they had pre-prepared a stockpile of rocks. They then stoned Meisner to death.

4. Arshid A’Hamid Yusuf Yusuf (Fatah. Born 1968, resident of Judea & Samaria, arrested 1993) was sentenced to five life sentences after having been convicted of the murders of Nadal Rabu Jaab, Adnan Ayaad Dib, Mufid Canaan, Tawfik Jaradat and Ibrahim Said Ziad by stabbing. Arsheed was also indicted on several additional counts of attempted murder of others he also suspected of ‘collaboration’.

5. Al-Haj Othman Amar Mustafa (Fatah. Born 1968, resident of Judea & Samaria, arrested 1989) was sentenced to a life sentence for his part in the murder of 48 year-old Frederick Steven Rosenfeld in June 1989.

Rosenfeld was hiking in the hills near Ariel when he came across a group of shepherds who stabbed him to death with his own knife and hid his body.

6. Matslah Abdallah Salama (Hamas. Born 1969, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested 1993) was sentenced to one life sentence for the murder of Reuven David in Petah Tikva in 1991.

Together with an accomplice, Matslah entered 59 year-old Iraqi-born Reuven David’s mini-market, tied him up, gagged him and then beat him to death, before escaping in the victim’s car. He left a wife, three children and several grandchildren.

7. Abu-Musa Salam Ali Atia (Fatah. Born 1971, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested 1994) was convicted of the murder of Isaac Rotenburg from Holon as part of an initiation rite for joining a terror organisation and sentenced to one life sentence.

Holocaust survivor Isaac Rotenberg was born in Poland. Most of his family was murdered in the Sobibor death camp, but Isaac managed to escape and joined the partisans. After the war he tried to make his way by ship to mandate Palestine, but was interred by the British and sent to a detention camp in Cyprus until 1947. After his release Isaac arrived in pre-state Israel and fought in the War of Independence. He continued his work as a plasterer even after pension age and in March 1994 was at his place of work in Petah Tikva when he was attacked by two Palestinian labourers with axes. He died, aged 67, two days later.

8. Miklad Mahmoud Ziad Salah (Fatah. Born 1973, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested 1993) was sentenced to one life sentence for the murder of 39 year-old Yehoshua Deutch in Kfar Yam, Gush Katif, in March 1993. In addition he fired shots at an army post and tried to murder a local resident.

Yehoshua Deutch grew flowers and it was in his greenhouse that he was stabbed in the heart by Miklad.

9. Tsualha Bad Almajid Mahamad (Fatah. Born 1973, resident of Judea & Samaria, arrested 1990) was sentenced to one life sentence for the murder – together with accomplices – of Baruch Heizlerand the attempted murder of Betty Malka, Shai Cohen and Avishag Cohen in 1990 whilst he was still a minor.

Baruch Heizler – named after his grandfather who was killed by Jordanian shelling of the Old City of Jerusalem during the War of Independence – was 24 when he was stabbed to death whilst travelling on the number 66 bus in Ramat Gan after having missed the ride to his seminary. Three other passengers were injured in the same attack.

10. Sha’at Aazat Shaba’an Aataf (Fronts. Born 1964, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested 1993) was sentenced to 29 years’ imprisonment after having been convicted of accessory to murder and was due to be released on 14/3/2022. Sha’at drove his accomplices to and from the scene of the murder of 51 year-old Simcha Levi in Khan Yunis in 1993.

Simcha Levi was born in Persia in 1942 and immigrated with her family to Israel in 1950, settling in Moshav Patish in the Negev. Simcha’s job was to drive Arab labourers to their place of work and on the day of her murder she picked up female labourers in Khan Yunis in the south Gaza Strip. Three terrorists disguised as women beat and stabbed her to death in her vehicle in a pre-planned attack.

11. Abdel-Aal Sayid Ouda Yusef ( Born 1979, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested in 1994) was sentenced to 22 years for, along with accomplices, throwing 2 grenades – which did not explode – at Border Police forces. On a different occasion, he placed a bomb next to a Border Police facility but the explosion did not cause damage. Also, he knew about the intention to harm a civilian and aided the process of his murder (Ian Sean Feinberg) by passing information to the perpetrators regarding the absence of soldiers in the area. Also, together with his cell, tortured a local resident suspected of collaboration. After he left the scene, the victim was murdered by his two accomplices. On a separate occasion, he intended to murder a local resident suspected of collaboration.

Ian Sean Feinberg was born in South Africa and immigrated to Israel after finishing High School. Having qualified in law before his enlistment, he spent five years serving as a lawyer in the Gaza Strip and was later involved professionally with Palestinian economic development as a legal advisor. On April 18th 1993, during a business meeting in the Rimal neighborhood of Gaza City, terrorists burst into the room announcing that they had ‘come to kill the Jew’. They then murdered him with gunshots and an axe. Ian was 30 at the time of his death. He was survived by his wife and three children.

12. Barbach Faiz Rajab Madhat (PFLP. Born 1974, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested in 1994) was sentenced to life imprisonment for, together with his accomplices, stabbing his employer (Moshe Becker) to death.

Moshe Beker was born in Poland in 1933 and immigrated to mandate Palestine in 1935. On January 21st 1994, Moshe arrived at his orchard in Rishon L’Tsion to see whether his employee had arrived. He was ambushed there by three terrorists, who had slept on site and waited for him. They attacked him, stabbed him to death with a knife and a pair of pruning shears, and fled. Moshe, 61 at the time of his death, was survived by his wife and four children.

13. Raai Ibrahim Salam Ali (Fatah. Born 1957, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested 1994) was sentenced to life imprisonment for the murder – using an axe – of 79 year-old Morris Aizenshtat who was sitting on a park bench in Kfar Saba reading a book at the time.

14. Nashbat Jabar Yusef Mahmed (Born 1961, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested in 1990) was sentenced to 25 years for taking part in a lynching of an IDF soldier, Amnon Pomerantz. He was due to be released on 20/9/2015.

Amnon Pomerantz was an electrical engineer and scientist and worked in research and development. On September 20th 1990, Amnon left his home in Havatzelet Hasharon for reserve duty in Gaza. Three hours later, he was brutally murdered by a gang of Palestinian rioters after he took a wrong turn on the way to his base and accidentally entered Al Burj Refugee Camp. After they threw rocks at him, they poured gasoline on his vehicle and ignited it with Amnon inside. It was noted that Nashbat did not express regret for his acts. Amnon was 46 at the time of his death. He was survived by his wife and three children.

15. Mortja Hasin Ghanam Samir (Hamas. Born in 1970, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested 1993) was sentenced to 20 years in prison for his part in the abduction, interrogation, torture and murder of four local residents suspected of collaboration with the authorities – Samir Alsilawi, Khaled Malka, Nasser Akila, and Ali Al Zaabot. Also, he abducted local residents suspected of ‘moral crimes’ for interrogation. His release date was 28.10.2013.

16. Sualha Fazah Ahmed Husseini (Fatah. Born 1973, resident of Judea and Samaria, arrested 1990) was given a life sentence for stabbing Baruch Heizler to death on a bus together with an accomplice and also attempting to murder three additional female passengers.

Baruch Heizler – named after his grandfather who was killed by Jordanian shelling of the Old City of Jerusalem during the War of Independence – was 24 when he was stabbed to death whilst travelling on the number 66 bus in Ramat Gan after having missed the ride to his seminary. Betty Malka, Shai Cohen and Avishag Cohen were injured in the same attack.

17. Ramahi Salah Abdallah Faraj (Fatah. Born in 1966, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested 1992) was given a life term for killing Avraham Kinstler. Also, whilst in Israel without a permit, he broke into a car a stole a gun. While in prison, he tried to obtain a weapon for another prisoner in order to kidnap a soldier.

Avraham Kinstler was born in Polish Galicia in 1908 and immigrated to mandate Palestine with his wife. On July 7th 1992, Avraham – who had not retired – went to work in his orchard as usual. There he was ambushed by a terrorist and murdered with a farming implement. Avraham was 84 years old at the time of his death. He was survived by three daughters and six grandchildren.

18. Abu-Sitta Ahmed Sayid Aladin (Fatah. Born 1970, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested 1994) was sentenced to two life terms for killing David Dedi and Chaim Weitzman together with accomplices.

19. Abu-Sitta Taleb Mohammed Ayman (Fatah. Born 1971, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested 1994) was given two life terms for breaking into an apartment in Ramle and murdering two people, David Dedi and Chaim Weitzman together with accomplices. Afterwards, they mutilated the bodies and cut off their ears as proof of the action.

David Dadi was born in Tunis and immigrated to Israel as a child, settling in Ramla. On December 31st 1993, David, along with his acquaintance Chaim Weizman, was stabbed to death in his sleep in his flat in Ramla by labourers from Gaza who were working in a neighboring apartment. David was 43 at the time of his death.

Chaim Weizman was born in Morocco. His family immigrated to Israel in 1962 and settled in Ramla. On December 31st 1993 – aged 33 – he was stabbed to death in his sleep by terrorists whilst staying at the apartment of his friend David Dadi. He was survived by his son, parents and siblings.

20. Mantsur Omar Abdel Hafiz Asmat (Born in 1976, resident of Judea and Samaria, arrested in 1993) was convicted of accessory to murder and sentenced to 22 years. He found out during work about the intention of his colleagues to murder a civilian (Chaim Mizrahi) and during the murder, helped the murderers to overpower the victim and after his death, placed the body in the boot of his car.

Chaim Mizrachi grew up in Bat Yam and Holon, later moving to Beit El. On Friday, 29th October 1993, he went to buy eggs from an Arab-owned farm near his home, and was met by terrorists who attacked him and fled in his vehicle after wounding him and stuffing him into the car’s trunk. The terrorists murdered Chaim, then burned and abandoned the vehicle north of Ramallah. Chaim was 30 at the time of his death, and was survived by his pregnant wife, his parents, his sisters, and his brother. Half-a-year after his murder, his daughter was born.

21. Asakra Mahmad Ahmed Khaled (Fatah. Born 1972, resident of Judea & Samaria, arrested in 1991) was convicted of the murder of French national Annie Lei in April 1991 and sentenced to life imprisonment.

64 year-old Ms Lei was a tourist visiting Bethlehem and was eating in the restaurant where Asakra worked when he stabbed her to death.

22. Jandiya Yusef Raduan Nahad (Fatah. Born 1973, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested in 1989) was sentenced to 25.5 years’ imprisonment for his part – whilst still a minor – in the murder of 64 year-old Zalman Shlein with his release due on 13/1/2015.

Zalman Shlein was born in Poland and as a fifteen year-old boy was forced to escape Nazi persecution by leaving his home and family. He arrived in mandate Palestine in 1947 and settled in Gan Yavne where he married and raised his family, working as a building contractor. In July 1989 he was stabbed and beaten to death by Jandiya and another Arab labourer at a construction site. Jandiya later tried to escape from prison but was caught.

23. Hamdiya Mahmoud Awad Muhammed (Fatah. Born 1972, resident of the Gaza Strip, arrested in 1989) was also convicted of the murder of Zalman Shlein and sentenced to 25.5 years with his release scheduled for 13/1/2015. Like his accomplice, he also tried to escape from prison and was caught.

24. Abdel-Nebi a’Wahab Gamal Jamil (Hamas. Born 1963, resident of Judea & Samaria, arrested in 1992) was sentenced to 21 years’ imprisonment having been convicted of accessory to murder and was due to be released on 14/12/2013. Abdel-Nebi drove the getaway vehicle after a terrorist shooting at the Machpelah Cave in Hebron in October 1992 in which reservist Shmuel Geresh was killed and Ronen Cohen was injured.

32 year-old Shmuel Geresh – the son of Holocaust survivors – left a wife and two children.

25. Ziwad Muhammed Taher Taher (Palestinian Islamic Jihad. Born 1971, resident of Judea & Samaria, arrested 1993) was sentenced to 21 years in prison for his part (together with two others) in the fatal shooting of Avraham Cohen and was scheduled for release on 05/02/2014.

26. Tsabiach Abed Hamed Burhan was arrested in 2001 for the murder of four Palestinians – Jamil Mohammed, Naim Tsaviach, Ayisha Abdallah and Haradi Marwach.

.


Rich Armbach

Tue, 08/13/2013 - 13:38

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I can see you are with me on this one Harv.
It would have been better that these people were not to be released at this time. Then there would be no yawn inducing talks and we could get on with the real job of turning the de facto one state between the river and the sea into a democracy.


Harvey

Tue, 08/13/2013 - 16:28

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It's simply a tale of two societies .
Both sides know the negotiations have almost zero chance of success but are necessary in order to appease the Americans . Each side has made clear its priorities for a return to the negotiating table .
For the Palestinians , it means getting back an evil bunch of cut throats and psychopaths who will doubtless 'enrich ' Palestinian society . Streets will be named after them and children will idolise them as heroes and role models . Israel on the other hand will build homes for families .
Neither will increase the likelihood of peace but the priorities say much about the two societies .


joemillis1959

Tue, 08/13/2013 - 17:09

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Yet more leapfrogging. One way to sort out this blog and give people a feeling that they have a good chance of being heard is to prevent one person, Jose the blacklisted dictatore goldfish, from leapfrogging his messages due to his self importance and megalomania.


Harvey

Tue, 08/13/2013 - 17:57

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Absolutely right Joe . Each house a family, celebrating Shabbat with lit candles
Not terrorists though Joe . Ordinary people living ordinary lives not having killed anyone . Maybe some are doctors working at Hadassah looking after Jews and Muslims , Christians and all else . But not murderers , cut throats and the like . So yes a price tag . Murderers for homes . The Palestinians were not going to get their monsters back without some serious recompense and while the settlements will not assist the charade of peace negotiations , I know which trade off I would rather have . How tragic that the Palestinians are satisfied with their particular 'gain' .


joemillis1959

Tue, 08/13/2013 - 17:57

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That's about 46 houses in the occupied territories per prisoner. That's the Price Tag policy that has informed some settler terrorists. I suppose you could say that those houses in the occupied territories have blood on their metaphorical hands.


happygoldfish

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 08:04

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joemillis1959: That's about 46 houses in the occupied territories per prisoner. That's the Price Tag policy that has informed some settler terrorists. I suppose you could say that those houses in the occupied territories have blood on their metaphorical hands.

joe, are you using words at random?

price tag has nothing to do with this, and the blood is on the hands of the soon-to-be-released murderers, not the new houses!

see eg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_tag_policy

Price tag policy (Hebrew: מדיניות תג מחיר) is a policy used by Israeli right-wing extremists and radical settlers, which seek what they see as "revenge" against random Palestinians and against the Israeli security forces, mostly through acts of property damage, arson and graffiti. According to the New York Times, price tag activists attempt to exact a price from local Palestinians or from the Israeli security forces for any action taken against their settlement enterprise.

… the illegal price tag movement, condemned by most politicians and settler organisations, involves attacks on property but not generally on people

netanhyahu's proposed houses do not even go that far: they will cause injury neither to property nor to people … how can they possibly have blood on their hands??

joe, you must try to break your programming, and abandon the Bromley Reform way of showing love for israel: choosing words at random, and using them against israel without regard to meaning or context!


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 08:20

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Joshua 17 3/4
Do try to keep up otherwise its detention

https://m.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10101983497506948&id=5701059&set=a...


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 08:23

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# BDS fail


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 08:33

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Joe
How can you equate building homes for families with the actions of mass murdering sociopaths ?. How are you able to look at yourself in the mirror and see yourself as a Zionist with comments like this ? Are you not in the least bit ashamed ?


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 08:42

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Was that crib sheet from Danny Seaman's new Ministry of Truth, harvey? So, in this single state "paradise" between the river and the sea that you and Hamas seem hell bent (Bennett?) on creating these price tag settlement homes will be only for Jews who light Shabbat candles. What about Jews who don't? Or non-Jews? Are they to be excluded from these gated, gilded ghettos? Is that your vision of Israel? Which regime does it remind you of?
Zionism was supposed to end the ghetto mentality. You seem to want to perpetuate it.


happygoldfish

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 08:46

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joe, why do you keep repeating this lie about me??

joemillis1959 (Mon 29th July, 18:56 & Tue 13th Aug, 18:57): … Jose the blacklisted dictatore goldfish …

joe millis, elected deputy for bromley reform synagogue, wants to accuse me of racism
he knows that he can't quote anything i've written to support this

so instead he quotes what someone else has written – under a pseudonym – and accuses me of being that person

he tells this lie not once but repeatedly, in a cyberbullying campaign to try to chase me off this website

he has decided what he wants to be true, and then says it anyway, in the absence of any evidence other than his own prejudice, and contrary to the actual evidence

he knows that he has no grounds for his lie, but he also knows that it is impossible for me to disprove it (because of the other person's pseudonym)

this is how the elected deputy for bromley reform synagogue pursues his baseless hatred


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 08:47

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Joe
You used the term Price Tag ( properly fisked by HG )
How do you equate home building with mass murder .
Simple question ?


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 08:49

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One led to the other Harvey. Price tag. Now answer mine if you dare reveal your one stater credentials.


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 08:51

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To quote Netanyahu, Jose, if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it is a duck. So, despite your many protestations, it is no lie.


happygoldfish

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 08:57

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joemillis1959 : I too will continue to ignore him.

joe, do you actually read what you write?

ooh, wait … you're ignoring me some more!

joemillis1959 : …may I remind one and all to ignore his stuff.

it's a good job you're here to help them!

joemillis1959 : Another good tell that this Goldfish is none other the previously barred aforementioned is the fact that he will call everyone that disagrees with him a racist.

that's another lie (and a very obvious one)
joe millis, please stop ignoring my reply to your lie about me, and deleting it and reposting it later as if it was new
you have now repeated your lie over 50 times
here's my reply again

joemillis1959 : The JC used to have a policy of banning Anthony Posner and his various aliases: Blacklisted Dictator/Jose/Mitnachel et al. Let's reinstate that policy for his current alias, Happy Goldfish.

joemillis1959: (Mon 22nd April, 15:29) aka Anthony Posner/Jose/Blacklisted Dicktator/etc … Then he's like the Goldfish. And even less talented.

joemillis1959: (Thu 25th April, 16:52) Jose/Anthony Posner/Blacklisted Dicktator/etc is the Goldfish …

joemillis1959 (Fri 26h April, 17:39 & 18:28; Tue 30th April, 09:41 & 10:00): Jose/Anthony Posner/Blacklisted Dicktator/etc - aka the Happy Goldfish …

joemillis1959 (Mon 29th April, 18:06; Mon 29th April, 18:34): Why can't the JC deal with "Happy Goldfish" who also goes by the names off Lbnaz/Jose/blacklisted d/Anthony p/ etc? They were banned, why not he?

joemillis1959 (Thu 13th June, 18:59): I see that crappy goldfish/Jose/blacklisted Posner/ Anthony dick-tator etc is still posting and reposting despite being barred here several times.

joemillis1959 (Fri 19th July, 15:58 & 17:39): The only anti-arab racist I see here is Jose the Goldfish/Anthony Posner the Blacklisted Dictator

joemillis1959 (Fri 19th July, 17:54): Jose the Goldfish/Anthony Posner the Blacklisted Dictator… All Jose the Goldfish/Anthony Posner the Blacklisted Dictator ever does is re-post inanities, just like those whom you previously banned did. That's because he is one and the same as them.

joemillis1959 (Fri 19th July, 18:12 & 18:49): … Jose the Goldfish/Anthony Posner the Blacklisted Dictator … always claimed that all who disagreed with his view of Israel was a "racist". …All Jose the Goldfish/Anthony Posner the Blacklisted Dictator ever does is …because he is one and the same as them.

joemillis1959 (Fri 19th July, 18:51): As usual Jose the Goldfish/Anthony Posner the Blacklisted Dictator …

joemillis1959 (Mon 22nd July, 09:21 & 12:04 & 12:14 & 13:28): … Jose the goldfish/Posner the blacklisted dictator.

joemillis1959 (Mon 22nd July, 10:04 & 11:24 & 13:26): … Jose the goldfish/Posner the blacklisted dictator again …

joemillis1959 (Mon 22nd July,13:25): … Jose the Goldfish/Anthony Posner the Blacklisted Dictator … Jose the Goldfish/Anthony Posner the Blacklisted Dictator …

joemillis1959 (Mon 22nd July, 13:29): … Jose the goldfish/Anthony he blacklisted dictator …

joemillis1959 (Mon 22nd July, 14:23): Jose the blacklisted dictatorial goldfish …

joemillis1959 (Mon 22nd July, 15:28): … Jose the goldfish - blacklisted on so many websites … hiding behind many pseudonyms.

joemillis1959 (Mon 22nd July, 17:45 & 18:03 & 18:39 & 18:54): Jose the blacklisted cowardly dictatorial Goldfish …

joemillis1959 (Mon 22nd July, 17:46 & 18:06 & 18:39 & 18:59): I'm surprised that the JC allows a banned blogger like Jose the blacklisted dictatorial Goldfish-Posner …

joemillis1959 (Tue 23rd July, 13:15 & 14:29 & 15:44): … Jose Anthony Posner the blacklisted dictator Goldfish.

joemillis1959 (Tue 23rd July, 16:27): Jose the Goldfish/Anthony Posner the blacklisted dictator (quite properly blacklisted, in fact) …

joemillis1959 (Tue 23rd July, 16:59): Obviously, Jose the blacklisted dictator Goldfish …

joemillis1959 (Tue 23rd July, 17:48): Jose the dictatorial happy goldfish …

joemillis1959 (Tue 23rd July, 18:09): Meanhile, Jose the dictatorial blacklisted Goldfish-Posner …

joemillis1959 Wed 24th July, 18:57): Looks like Jose the blacklisted dictator Goldfish …

joemillis1959 Thu 25th July, 12:16): Maybe if the JC blocks Jose the Happy dictatorial blacklisted dictator …

joemillis1959 (Thu 25th July, 13:00 & 18:59; Fri 26th July, 16:55 & 17:04): The blogger who goes by the name of Happy Goldfish is a cyber-reincarnation of a person who has already been twice barred here - under the names of Jose, Blacklisted Dictator and Anthony Posner, as well as perhaps others.

joemillis1959 (Thu 25th July, 15:55): Not even jose the racist blaclisted goldfish dictator.

joemillis1959 (Thu 25th July, 16:58 & 18:59): "Bringing along Anthony 'Jose the blacklisted happygoldfish dictator' Posner …

joemillis1959 (Thu 25th July, 16:58 & 18:59; Fri 26th July, 16:39): "Bringing along Anthony 'Jose the blacklisted happygoldfish dictator' Posner …

joemillis1959 (Mon 29th July, 18:56 & Tue 13th Aug, 18:57): … Jose the blacklisted dictatore goldfish …

joemillis1959 (Tue 30th July, 13:37): … happygoldfish, a pseudonym for the banned Jose and blacklisted dictator …

joemillis1959 (Tue 30th July, 15:06): Me thinks the multi-pseudonym happygoldfish blacklisted dictator Jose doth protesteth too mucheth

joemillis1959 (Fri 9th Aug, 17:52 & 18:27): That's why they allow Jose the blacklisted dictator goldfish …

i have no connection with those, or with any other present or former bloggers on this site

joemillis1959: (Mon 25th March, 18:29) He may claim he's not, but his modus operandi is far too similar for it to be a coincidence.

uhh??

did any of the others know how to produce background colours, or red or blue type?

did any of the others preface every quote with a clickable link so that it could be checked?

did any of the others repeatedly link to their own outside blog about oranges ducks and arch-rabbis?

were any of the others goldfish? (you haven't even got the right species! )

oh … and did any of the others use smilies?

joe millis, please stop harrassing me, and propagating the lie that my behaviour has previously caused me to be banned

there are racists on this website who think there is nothing wrong with lying, so long as they are criticising israel, or criticising people who defend israel

they decide what they want to be true, and then say it anyway, in the absence of any evidence other than their own prejudice, and often contrary to the actual evidence

one reason why so few people defend israel on thejc.com … compared with other sites such as the guardian's "comment is free" … is the unchecked lying or bullying that they'll sooner or later be subjected to

joemillis1959: (Mon 25th March, 10:53) He may claim he's not, he may introduce all sorts of snazzy colourful backgrounds and daft graphics - any one with a modicum of HTML coding knowledge can do that (and Jose claimed to be a computer whizz kid) - but his modus operandi is far too similar for it to be a coincidence. Just ignore him.

some historians are motivated by a desire to present events in a manner consistent with their own beliefs even if that involves distortion and manipulation of evidence

joe millis is the author of an illustrated history of jerusalem

if his approach to evidence as a historian is as reliable as in his accusation against me, then his book may be an excellent buy as a work of fiction, or as a children's picture book, but cannot seriously be considered as a reliable research resource


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 09:18

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Joe
Have you seen this

EU COMMISSION BACKTRACKS ON BOYCOTT GUIDELINES

The Commission of the European Union has backtracked on the guidelines it issued in July concerning the eligibility of Israeli organisations for grants in respect of activities beyond the 1949 armistice line (the “green line”). The Commission now admits that although Israeli organisations located beyond the green line cannot themselves apply for EU grants, organisations (“entities”) located within the green line – as well as those located outside Israel - can apply for and receive grants in respect of activities that take place “anywhere in the West Bank.”

This clarification was contained in a statement provided (31 July) by the office of Baroness Ashton – the Commissioner responsible for the EU’s foreign policy - to Professor Geoffrey Alderman. Professor Alderman holds the Michael Gross Chair of Politics & Contemporary History at the University of Buckingham (England) and is Guest Professor at Ariel University, Samaria.

The statement makes clear that although Ariel University could not itself be a primary partner in an EU-funded project (a state of affairs which is not new), there is no impediment to Ariel hosting EU-funded events or other activities (for example, research). It further admits that although the exemptions listed in the guidelines purported to extend only to activities aimed at “promoting the Middle East peace process in line with EU policy,” in fact the EU will not discriminate against calls for proposals that have as their object the criticism of EU policy.

Welcoming this statement, Professor Alderman said that its contents went a long way to negating the impact of the guidelines, which – he pointed out – have yet to be implemented. "It is particularly gratifying [he said] to know that if I or my UK employing university received an EU-funded research grant, the funds could be spent at Ariel, or indeed anywhere else in the liberated territories


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 09:19

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# BDS fail


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 09:50

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Harvey, no answer? Must be really embarrassing to stand with Hamas as well as the neo nazi EDL. Or do you want Israel to be an apartheid state. Don't bother answering. You are obviously Jewish supremacist who wants a ghettoised vapartheid state. The only difference between you and the Hamas people is that they are Islamic supremacists.

By the way, that bollocks from the colonists' price tag radio station Arutz 7 is wishful thinking. Israel will make some noises about it being unfair but it recognises that the eu can spend its money where it wants. Did you know that eu grants have helped more than 100 Israeli techno whizz kids return home from wherever to continue their R&D. They and those who follow them are unlikely to be best pleased by the Israeli government's chucking toys out of the cot policies.

One stater policies that you and your puppet masters support will lead to more of this kind of nonsense. You'd love Israel to be vilified.


Advis3r

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 10:01

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Now here's the thing Mr Joe Millis actively supports apartheid that is he supports the creation of a State of Palestine in which no Jews will be allowed to enter much less live - compare and contrast that with the status of Arab citizens of the State of Israel. So he is in favour of the creation of something very much like Saudi Arabia and that he would like us to believe is progress.


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 10:18

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Every country has immigration laws. Does Israel allow non Jews to immigrate? Palestinians returning home to jaffo or safed, for instance? And what about those reception committees?

I suppose they are fine and dandy? What next? Pass laws?


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 10:19

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Joe
Stay in bed . That black dogs barking real hard this morning


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 10:33

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No answer from Harvey the Kahanazi.

Your black dogs may bark but the convoy continues. Ask an Israeli if you don't get the cultural reference. P


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 10:35

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A lesson in depravity . Israels erst while 'peace talks 'partner .

http://elderofziyon.blogspot.co.uk/2013/08/sickening-photos-of-abbas-cel...


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 10:39

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No doubt you will be on the next one # viva Gaza # renewing acquaintances


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 11:07

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Erstwhile? Do you even know what erstwhile means? Or is it like atavistic - one of those words you don't understand. Sounds bad, but actually isn't. Lesson for today Harvey is don't use big words you don't understand.


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 11:19

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Erst while as in former . Hence 'Peace partner ' , The italics meaning not current or sham . Add
# intellectual snobbery - failed - to your CV . Should you be needing that again


Harvey

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 11:46

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Joe
You are losing the plot mate .
Atavistic enterprise . Your words your tweet

https://mobile.twitter.com/joemillis1959/status/364722451877347330

Simply highlighted by me . You should have a lie down .
# Busted again


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 13:23

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Absolutely atavistic because there are 2000 odd years between the time jewish zealots destroyed the last commonwealth until zionisms emerged on the back of European romantic nationalism of The mid to late19th century. And just over120 later settler zealots will lead to this ones destruction.

Read all about it in the PhD thesis, the self-destructive policies of Israeli goverents 1968-2000 (OUP, 2014 or thereabouts). I'm trying to get clint Eastwood to play tha title role


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 13:24

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Absolutely atavistic because there are 2000 odd years between the time jewish zealots destroyed the last commonwealth until zionisms emerged on the back of European romantic nationalism of The mid to late19th century. And just over120 later settler zealots will lead to this ones destruction.

Read all about it in the PhD thesis, the self-destructive policies of Israeli goverents 1968-2000 (OUP, 2014 or thereabouts). I'm trying to get clint Eastwood to play tha title role


Ben F

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 16:27

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A new and much improved version...

http://wp.me/P3pxXH-8E


Ben F

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 16:36

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Harvey, if they carry on building homes for families at this rate, they soon will have replaced all the ones they have demolished.


joemillis1959

Wed, 08/14/2013 - 17:20

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Sorry for the multiples, but that's what happens when you type on a smartphone with a wonky 3G connection. Orange, eh...
Anyhoo... Zionism is atavistic because there are 2000 odd years between the time jewish zealots destroyed the last Jewish commonwealth until political Zionism emerged as a Jewish national theory on the back of European romantic nationalism of The mid to late19th century. And just over120 years later settler zealots appear to be leading to this Jewish sovereign national home's destruction. Perhaps we don't do nationalism. Perhaps it's not in our genetic make up. We appear to be too quarrelsome to reach some kind of consensus of what in fact we mean by a Jewish state in the modern world (hell, some of us can't agree on a definition of who is a Jew). There's also the issue of defining a national homeland for the Jewish people. Sovereign state or cultural and political autonomy as part of a federated state?

Read all about it in the PhD thesis, The Self-Destructive Policies of Israeli Governments, 1968-2000 (OUP, 2014 or thereabouts). I'm trying to get Clint Eastwood to play in the film version.

Time to let the idiot savant Jose leapfrog his repetitive postings. It's his life. He has no other.


joemillis1959

Thu, 08/15/2013 - 08:40

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And to prove my point, jumping Jose jumps his stuff again, and this time with added lack of reading comprehension.


joemillis1959

Thu, 08/15/2013 - 08:44

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I will now leave you in the multi personality's incapable hands for the next few days.


Advis3r

Thu, 08/15/2013 - 09:11

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Mr Millis asks - Does Israel allow non Jews to immigrate?

Well for a start approximately 24-26% of the Russians who immigrated in the 1990's were not Jewish and many of them refused to convert.

The problem as I see it is your inability to accept that being Jewish covers both a religious and a national identity. Some Jews accept both some Jews accept one but not the other. You appear to delegitimize anyone who accepts both by calling them zealots.

You may not do nationalism but there are millions of Jews living in Israel who do. Our nationalism however is not that of the BNP or any other national socialists you care to mention our nationalism is born of a four thousand plus year common heritage.

Your misnomer as zealots of those millions of us who wish to preserve our right to self determination in what we consider to be our homeland against the lack of any credible claim by those who purely wish to seek the destruction of the Jews as a people (read the Hamas Charter for an insight into their thinking)clearly shows your lack of any real understanding of what it is to be a Jew.

On another tack I wonder what your reaction will be when, if in the events which happen a Palestinian state is created in Judea and Samaria, and the first Grad lands in or near Ben Gurion Airport as unfortunately it is bound to do, given that by what they say and do the Arabs want a State without peace.


joemillis1959

Thu, 08/15/2013 - 11:26

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Norm, as you well know, those Russians arrived under the law of return which stipulates you need only one jewish grandparent irrespective of gender to emigrate to Israel and enjoy full rights.

Nice try though, to try and obfuscate.

Nationhood? Totally atavistic as the notion was created only in the late 19th century in Europe. Up till then Jews defined themselves religiously. Heck, to become Jewish you have to undergo a religious conversion (no matter what strand), not a civil national process. Nationalism derives from the growth of 18th and 19th century secularism, not religious thought.

The zealots are the ultra right wing settlers who hold the state hostage. Their ultra right wing nationalism is exactly the same as the BNP's, except they are more violent and wield a huge amount of influence in successive governments.

But thanks for raising interesting points.


Advis3r

Thu, 08/15/2013 - 11:28

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Millis Millis please see
http://www.firstthings.com/onthesquare/2010/10/israeli-christians-uncomf...

obfuscation is your game not mine - you said quote Does Israel allow non-jews to immigrate? I have shown that it does - why did you wriggle so when you are caught.

Judaism is a religion that is why you have to undergo a process to become a Jew as you do to become a Muslim buddhist etc etc.

However you do not have to be Jewish to be an Israeli - think about it and think about the non-Jews who serve in the Israeli Army for purely nationalistic reasons.

No comment I see about the first Grad to fall on Ben Gurion airport - but there again those proponents of a two state solution have never stopped to think what it means when the other side has no intention of making peace as long as it gets a state and a staging post for the Iranian Revolutionary Guards.


joemillis1959

Thu, 08/15/2013 - 11:57

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Under Israeli law of return, Cohen, those Russians, Ukrainians, Kazakhs etc were Jewish, hence they were allowed to immigrate with full and immediate rights. Would a Palestinian whose family left/fled/were forced out of Tzfat or Tiberius or Jaffo have the same right?

As for the indigenous non-Jews, they are there. I'm sure many if not all of the self-destructivr zealots would rather they weren't - perhaps you among them - but hey, them's the breaks v

If Ben-Gurion airport is attacked, I'm sure the mighty long range arm of what Harvey called a kick arse army will be able to deal with it. Soupy honestly think anyone believes Israel is some kind of nebbach? I know that's what Israel wants the world to believe, but it ain't.

And as you say yourself, Judaism is a religion - a belief system - not a national grouping.


joemillis1959

Thu, 08/15/2013 - 17:58

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Jose has a reading comprehension failure. He obviously doesnt know what "I wonder" means. Hes also racisticly whitewashing the settlers, since he precludes the possibility that the busy road could - note could - be a settler only road.

And Oops
http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/.premium-1.541772


happygoldfish

Fri, 08/16/2013 - 08:08

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Ben F: Seems there's been another face lift. http://wp.me/P3pxXH-8E

Ben F: A new and much improved version... http://wp.me/P3pxXH-8E

Rich Armbach: http://eappiblog.wordpress.com/

(this is from maureen jack's blog, http://maureenjackea.wordpress.com/2013/01/29/access-to-education/)

zaheerayin: Oh great! The traumatised kids just love it!

zaheerayin, there's nothing in rich's link about the children being traumatised … on the contrary, it says "The children were full of fun, and a couple of the boys grinned as I was hauled out and up from inspecting the tunnel." oh, and here's her picture of abdullah saying he likes school, but he doesn't like the tunnel … traumatised?

zaheerayin, you just like making things up

this official eappi article shows exactly why it is so wrong for the church of england to associate itself with eappi

this eappi activist accuses israel of a breach of international humanitarian law

‘Everyone has the right to education.’ Article 26 (1), Universal Declaration of Human Rights,1948 (has been ratified by Israel.)
‘Education is a fundamental human right and essential for the exercise of all other human rights. It promotes individual freedom and empowerment and yields important development benefits.’ UNESCO http://www.unesco.org/new/en/education/themes/leading-the-international-...
International humanitarian law and international human rights law are central to the work of EAPPI. One of our tasks is to monitor children’s access to education.

… based on totally misleading reporting

eappi claim that israel is in breach because smaller children of ka'abne crawl through a 60 cm high 12-metre culvert to get to school because a dangerous main road is in the way

israel has not built a special road between the village and the school, the road was always there!

the better the palestinian economy gets, the more traffic will be on that road

the bigger children (and the teachers) do manage to cross the road

the smaller children find it more fun to walk crouched along the culvert … i think they're right!

no doubt, eaapi activists will soon be visiting churches around england showing photos of these children to show how terrible israel is to palestinian children!

joemillis1959: Is that a settler only road, i wonder.

joe, you know perfectly well it isn't

the eappi report (which you've read) (and which is still there!) says quite specifically that it's a "a busy main road, which cars speed along" …

nothing about it being a settler-only road, which eappi would have been sure to mention

why does the elected deputy for bromley reform think there's nothing wrong with making things up so long as one's criticising israel?

joemillis1959: Is that a settler only road, i wonder.

joe, you know perfectly well it isn't

the eappi report (which you've read) (and which is still there!) says quite specifically that it's a "a busy main road, which cars speed along" …

nothing about it being a settler-only road, which eappi would have been sure to mention

joemillis1959: Jose has a reading comprehension failure. He obviously doesnt know what "I wonder" means.

joe, what i said was (only) "joe, you know perfectly well it isn't "

you haven't answered that … all you've done is defend yourself against the imagined allegation of lying (that your own "reading comprehension failure" saddled you with )

i didn't accuse you of lying, i only accused you of baseless hatred, ie speculation totally unsupported by any evidence and clearly contradictory to the evidence that you rely on

joe millis is an established historical author (of an illustrated history of jerusalem)

he has read the eappi report (by maureen jack) … a eye-witness report by someone who has seen the road herself …

he knows it is intended to be critical of israel (nothing in itself wrong with that, of course) …

so as a historian he can be confident that if there was such an allegation to be made (that the road only benefits israelis), then the writer would have made it

he knows perfectly well that his own evidence is entirely against him

some historians are motivated by a desire to present events in a manner consistent with their own beliefs even if that involves distortion and manipulation of evidence

if joe millis's approach to evidence as a historian is as reliable as this particular allegation (and as his 50-times repeated accusation against me of being a previously-banned blogger, also without any grounds), then his book may be an excellent buy as a work of fiction, or as a children's picture book, but cannot seriously be considered as a reliable research resource

for the record: joe, i do know what "i wonder" means … it's a phrase which people add to an untrue speculation in order to get away with it

do all members of bromley reform consider it acceptable for their elected deputy to make allegations without evidence and/or contrary to the evidence?

i wonder!

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