Settlers are "anti-Zionist"


By telegramsam
October 15, 2010
Share

So says Israeli academic Gadi Taub at Dissent magazine
His reasoning?

But what is worse is that eventually this encroachment on the future Palestine will not achieve Netanyahu’s goals—it will achieve the goal of religious settlers. If they have their way, their asphalt and concrete will prevent partition into two states and will drown the ship of Zionism in a Lebanon-like bi-national swamp. Religious settlers are therefore not just a clear and present danger to peace, or to peace talks, but an existential threat to Zionism itself. Supporting settlement is an anti-Zionist stance. The grounds for resisting the settlers’ enterprise are not only the right of Palestinians to self-determination but also the right of Jews to self-determination. Zionists and their allies must therefore oppose further settlement, for Israel’s, not just Palestine’s, sake.

COMMENTS

Advis3r

16 October, 2010 - 17:52

Rate this:

0 points

You have posted this crock of whatsit three times and it does not make it any more palatable or indeed anymore true. A touch of the Dr Goebbels syndrome again?
The 1922 Mandate for Palestine made it quite clear that the Jews had the right to settle the whole of what was their ancient homeland. Just because the so-called International Community that is so-beloved of the BBC now resiles from allowing the Jews their right to self-determination in their ancient homeland does not mean we as Jews should listen to them. For two thousand years they seemingly controlled our destiny and look where that took us. Now we have a measure of control over our own destiny the International Community can gnash their teeth as much as they like while we build up the country as we are meant to do. Mr Taub can pontificate as much as he likes about what he perceives "Zionism" to be but the settling by Jews of all of the Land of Israel is what Zionism is all about.
It seems that in every decade a different excuse is given for surrendering the Israeli heartland. In the 80s it was: This is an occupation of foreign land and immoral. When this failed to convince the public, in the 1990’s it became: If we surrender land we will get peace. After the Oslo terror wave, when this line of reasoning was revealed as preposterous, it became a nationalist argument in the 2000s: The demographic threat forces us to give up Judea and Samaria. After this claim was also debunked due to plummeting Arab birthrates and rising Jewish ones and the revelation as to the real number of Arabs in Yesha, a new seemingly waterproof argument has been proposed for 2010: We must surrender land in order for the Americans to agree to save us from Iran and holding on to it is anti-Zionist.
The answer to this claim is twofold. First, the State of Israel was founded because the Jewish people decided that it could no longer rely on the gentiles to protect them. Unfortunately the State was founded only after the Holocaust, but Israel’s first leaders all came here long before. The Jewish State was proof that the Jewish people were going to take responsibility for their own destiny and no longer rely on others.
Secondly, the surrender of Jewish land ultimately weakens us. The strongest argument we have against the Arab claim that we are imposters in the region is our moral right to our land. When we hold onto our land we show the Arabs we are natives here and it is they who are encroaching. While this does not change the physical balance of power, it does provide the inner reasoning without which no battle can be fought – just cause. It is the justness of the cause which is ultimately our strongest weapon. By giving in to Arab demands we are just showing them that we do not even believe in our own right to the Land.


Advis3r

16 October, 2010 - 18:17

Rate this:

0 points

For further enlightenment I recommend this
http://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/2010/10/jewish-flexibility-and-arab.htm...
Happy reading!


telegramsam

16 October, 2010 - 18:38

Rate this:

0 points

Going straight into Godwin Law mode, in bold, noch, does you no favours, Ad/Av. Yes, Jews have a right to their ancient homeland, but like in ancient times, the borders changed from time to time and according to circumstances.
And as the Jews returned to land that was already inhabited by another people, a compromise is necessary so that both national movements can determine their paths.
The only ones claiming that Palestinian birthrates are dropping in the occupied territories are the settlers and the quasi-governmental Central Bureau of Statistics, neither of whom has proper access to Palestinian figures and both of whom have an agenda.
I think Netanyahu is going down the route he is going -- the two-state solution -- is because as the words of the Israeli song say: the things you see from here you cannot see from there. IOW, he knows and believes the figures, not the settlers' hype.


telegramsam

16 October, 2010 - 18:40

Rate this:

0 points

And part from that, I think I'll follow Jonathan's lead for once and not response to the baiters and haters (like you)


Advis3r

16 October, 2010 - 19:29

Rate this:

0 points

"and not response (sic) to the baiters and haters (like you)"

Ha!Ha! Had to chuckle at that one from the chief Jewbaiter himself. I did not post in bold - ask the JC why it appeared in bold.

No real response however - total rubbish about the CBS
which for visitors to this site is as follows:
The Central Bureau of Statistics (CBS) was established several months after the establishment of the State of Israel, as an autonomous unit within the Prime Minister’s Office. The establishment of the CBS was a direct continuation of the activities of the statistical departments of the British Mandate government, and the Jewish Agency for Israel which operated during the period of the Mandate.

The CBS is headed by the Government Statistician, who also serves as the Director of the CBS, with a Public Council for Statistics accompanying him.

The CBS operates by the power of the Statistics Ordinance (New Version), 5732 - 1972. The Statistics Ordinance defines the tasks of the CBS, its mode of operation, the obligation of the public to provide information to the CBS, the obligation of the CBS to safeguard the confidentiality of the information obtained, and the obligation of the CBS to publish the results of its statistical activities.

The functions of the CBS:
To perform statistical activities and projects regarding the State and its population, in the fields of health, wellbeing, education, economy etc., as well as on the subjects of physical, geographic and ecological indices; and to publish the results; To cooperate with State offices and other bodies in order to conduct statistical projects and to publish their results; To prepare, in consultation with the Public Council for Statistics, multi-annual general schemes for the statistical activities of State offices; To decide, in conjunction with the Public Council for Statistics and the bodies concerned, on uniform statistical classifications for the use of Government offices; To collect and publish information on statistical projects that are performed or planned by or for the Bureau or State offices.

Three main guiding principles of CBS activities:
Independence - The CBS is an apolitical, independent and professional body, which takes responsibility for the results of its professional activities.
Reliability - The CBS uses scientific methods based on international professional standards, and is meticulous in maintaining the reliability of the data. The CBS is one of the statistical bureaus that has adopted the strict regulations of the International Monetary Fund for the dissemination of statistical data.
Strict confidentiality of personal data - Strict confidentiality of data is ensured according to the Statistics Ordinance. The CBS maintains strict confidentiality of personal and business data as a basic premise guiding its activities. The CBS does not transmit any personal information about residents, or any specific business information about companies and corporations.

So much for "have an agenda" It is the usual ploy of Israel bashers when they have no valid counter argument they bash the messenger.


telegramsam

16 October, 2010 - 19:39

Rate this:

0 points

When it comes to baiting, you be the master.

The Central Bureau of Statistics (CBS) was established several months after the establishment of the State of Israel, as an autonomous unit within the Prime Minister’s Office.

No agenda, huh?


Advis3r

16 October, 2010 - 21:07

Rate this:

0 points

Since when was trying to put you straight baiting? if it is too hot in the kitchen why don't you try blogging at CIF lots of your friends there.

As to the CBS - Three main guiding principles of CBS activities:among others are:-
Independence - The CBS is an apolitical, independent and professional body, which takes responsibility for the results of its professional activities.
Reliability - The CBS uses scientific methods based on international professional standards, and is meticulous in maintaining the reliability of the data. The CBS is one of the statistical bureaus that has adopted the strict regulations of the International Monetary Fund for the dissemination of statistical data.

Right as you say no agenda! Hard living with the truth especially when it disproves your arguments.


telegramsam

16 October, 2010 - 21:13

Rate this:

0 points

But it's in the PMO. How can it be Independent if it's there? And so it says it uses x methodology. So what. East Germany used to be a people's Democratic Republic. It wasn't.


Advis3r

16 October, 2010 - 22:09

Rate this:

0 points

Now you are comparing Israel with East Germany!?! Wow you really are desperate.

POST A COMMENT

You must be logged in to post a comment.