British Jewry and the "leadersheep"

I doubt that British Jewry cares what the likes of Harper and Aznar think. My guess is that British Jewry and the leadersheep are in tune with each other. That the leadersheep understands that the people are not comfortable with the present situation and want a speedy, just solution that factors in history but subordinates it to the present and that enables everyone, the Jews and non Jews in the region, and the Diaspora, to just get on with what what we might call normal lives.

Harper and Aznar are wind up merchants with agendas of their own.

My family connections reinforce my view that the small number of rabid fanatics that overwhelm this blog site represent at best a very small minority and and at worst only themselves

"My guess is that British Jewry and the leadersheep are in tune with each other"

And as on every other point bar none, you are wrong.

simonson, they should care. They have no better friends - whether they have the wisdom to recognize it or not.

That you patently and arrogantly do not is simply tragic. And I mean that in its true sense.

As an occasional poster (but regular reader) here, I note Dr Simonson's survey of his family is:

My family connections reinforce my view that the small number of rabid fanatics that overwhelm this blog site represent at best a very small minority and and at worst only themselves".

A survey of Elisha's family connections agrees that the majority of British Jewish leaders are sheep.

Elisha's family have lot's of scientists within who say that you can't evaluate the populations view by the dozen or so people who write to newspapers or blogs.

So how do we know?

Elisha's family have lot's of scientists within who say that you can't evaluate the populations view by the dozen or so people who write to newspapers or blogs.
So how do we know?

jandrsimonson confused observation (something anyone can see, hear, etc.) with a correlation (something no one can see, hear, but which sometimes happen in the same time frame as another event). That is a major confusion.

So, confusing his beliefs with real events is rather a logical consequence of this. Let's remind that he added at least two atheists among the "small number of rabid fanatics". Which says a lot about how he made the small number grow. He probably doesn't count among the rabid fanatics those who propagate antisemitic propaganda such as "Jerusalem like Teheran", "Gaza like concentration camp", "Israelis like Nazis"...

And anyway, no one in these blogs represent any other than himself/herself, including jandrsimonson. Harper and Aznar represent at least a number of their supporters and it is important that such leaders, who are in power or might return to power, show their steadfast support to Israel. A friend in need is a friend indeed and Israel will remember it. Any of the British Jewry who performs less well than a real friend of Israel should be voted out and shown that they don't represent UK Jewry anymore.

I doubt there is any point in debating further the nature of inductive reasoning with Jose as he simply tries to cover up any real understanding with verbose attempts to baffle us with bull you know what. I will content myself with pointing out that that an observation is not something that is seen ( or heard ) it is that which is observed that is seen Duh !!!!!!!

In the absence of detailed carefully controlled study we have only our impressions to fall back on.My impression is that the knee jerk rabids represent, if anyone but themselves, a very small minority. An ancillary impression is that the younger the population sample the smaller this minority becomes.

In fact I don't think I have actually met any members of this rabid minority except on this blog site and they number only maybe about eight.

They have no interest in promoting any kind of a soloution and indeed petend not to hear when they are invite to offer somjething constructive. Maybe the smallness of the minority they " represent " and the knowledge that it gets smaller every day explains the rabidity of the rabidity.Alough small in numbers they manage to keep centre stage by sheer volume of incoherent noise. We can only seek to marginalise them.If they won't be part of a solution they should get out of the way of those that are willing to be.

They know who thy are.

"My guess is that British Jewry and the leadersheep are in tune with each other"

You're wrong and there is the opinion research to prove it.

http://www.jpr.org.uk/publications/publication.php?id=235

72% of British Jews regard themselves as Zionists

33% of 18-39 year olds think it at least 'fairly likely' that they will live in Israel

Jonathan, good morning. Thank you for bringing up the JPR's poll. A couple of things. Indeed, 72 per cent of British Jews regard themselves as Zionist. But Zionist, and as a Zionist yourself you would know this, covers the political spectrum from Meretz on the left to Herut UK on the right. So, in that respect, you can be a Zionist and agree with Mick Davis, Trevor Chinn, Poju Zablodovic, Lord Janner, Harvey Rose etc.
A second this is, the poll was about attitudes to Israel and was self-selecting, so only those with an interest in Israel were bothered enough to take part. And as an internet poll, it was quite probably easily manipulated, with the organisations urging their members to vote (I received at least three emails to that effect) and with some naughty people voting several times -- from behind proxies, glypes, with iPhones etc.
As for living in Israel, youngsters tend to be idealists until families and mortgages come along, then aliyah gets put on a backburner until retirement.
Have a good week.

For jandrsimonsons benfit a "controlled study" has taken place, as pointed out by Jonathan Hoffman at 10.02.
This study clearly shows that the overwhelming majority of Jews in the UK support Israel and are Zionists.
janrsimonson may not like the results of this study, but they are the outcome of well organised research and are fact.
Perhaps if jandrsimonson were to get out more he might meet Jews who are Zionists, if jandrsimnonson stays within his bubble of ever diminshing cicle of trendy, left-wing, quasi-acadamics and "knee-jerk" rabid Israel haters who attack Israel at every opportunity it is no wonder he wants to believe that is the reality - when in fact, jandrsimonson you only have to go to any NW London United synagogue shul on any shabbat morning, (Stanmore, Borehamwood & Elstree if you are not there by 9.00 am you cannot get a seat), for him to realise how wrong and how out of step he is with the current community thinking.

AND- what does janrsimonson mean by "If they won't be part of a solution", haven't we heard that expression somewhere before?

Good morning, Jon. As they say in parliament, I refer you to the answer I gave some moments ago (to Jonathan). One doesn't have to be a Herutnik or a Kahanist to be a Zionist. One can support Meretz, Mapam, Labour, Kadima or indeed the New Israel Fund.

Indeed, 72 per cent of British Jews regard themselves as Zionist. But Zionist, and as a Zionist yourself you would know this, covers the political spectrum from Meretz on the left to Herut UK on the right. So, in that respect, you can be a Zionist and agree with Mick Davis, Trevor Chinn, Poju Zablodovic, Lord Janner, Harvey Rose etc.
A second this is, the poll was about attitudes to Israel and was self-selecting, so only those with an interest in Israel were bothered enough to take part. And as an internet poll, it was quite probably easily manipulated, with the organisations urging their members to vote (I received at least three emails to that effect) and with some naughty people voting several times -- from behind proxies, glypes, with iPhones etc.
As for living in Israel, youngsters tend to be idealists until families and mortgages come along, then aliyah gets put on a backburner until retirement.
Have a good week.

Mr. jandrsimonson, "My family connections reinforce my view that the small number of rabid fanatics that overwhelm this blog site represent at best a very small minority and and at worst only themselves"

- some family. Why are people with whom you disagree "rabid fanatics"?

Maybe the extreme leftist views here could be termed "rabin fanatics"?

As for representation, you opened with: "my guess is ... " - your estimate is not a guess, it's wishful thinking.

I doubt there is any point in debating further the nature of inductive reasoning with Jose

Well the best reason why there isn't any point to debate is that you don't get it at all. And the fact that you add name-calling to your 'arguments' tells the whole story.

I will content myself with pointing out that that an observation is not something that is seen ( or heard ) it is that which is observed that is seen Duh !!!!!!!

"observation, n.
1. an act or instance of noticing or perceiving."
(c) Webster

Obfuscating won't help you, jandr.

Thank you, "The Bubble Maker"; a voice of sense amongst the tirade of non-sense from the lefties!

Let's congratulate the two leaders Mr. Harper and Mr. Aznar for saying aloud what any decent human being should say, but so few do say.

In neighboring Syria, Facebook is blocked altogether. And in Egypt, a blogger was charged with atheism in 2007 after intelligence officials monitored his posts.

Yet, have you heard lately the Israel-critics criticise Syria and Egypt for their repression of freedom of expression, freedom of religion? Something certainly much worse than, say, the gender separation in haredi-paid buses.

Husayin has not been charged but remains in detention, said Palestinian security spokesman Adnan Damiri.
He could face a life sentence if he's found guilty, depending on how harshly the judge thinks he attacked Islam and how widely his views were broadcast, said Islamic scholar Tamimi.

Life sentence for atheism! Those are the values of the future 'Palestinian' state? Surely something much worthy of criticism than shooting back at one's aggressor!

Even so, a small minority has questioned whether the government went too far.
Zainab Rashid, a liberal Palestinian commentator, wrote in an online opinion piece that Husayin has made an important point: "that criticizing religious texts for their (intellectual) weakness can only be combatted by ... oppression, prison and execution."

Some 'Palestinians' are even more critical of their dictatorship than the lefties on the JC.

They know who thy are.

Are you paid each time you use the propaganda word "rabid"?
Then, let's call it a day of work!

We know who you are. And you are indeed a very small minority here. Maybe you should make alyah to a Muslim country, where your propaganda would be well-received.

One can support Meretz, Mapam, Labour, Kadima or indeed the New Israel Fund.

Well, you forgot Israel Beitenu and Likud, and indeed Im Tirtzu, a group of students that do a wonderful job exposing the anti-Zionism of the New Israel Fund (which will certainly soon be renamed the George Soros Fund).

"observation, n.
1. an act or instance of noticing or perceiving."
(c) Webster

well precisely its that which is observed that is noticed or perceived not the observation or the seeing or perceiving

dear god who will rid me of this turbulent incoherent wannabe but never could be epistomologist ( his webster will tell him what that means )

"I doubt there is any point in debating further the nature of inductive reasoning with Jose"

How true, as far as you are concerned, since you have no clue what reasoning means.

"They know who they are ... blah ... blah ..."

Idiot.

Is my first impression correct, that jandrsimonson
gets into personal arguments and insults with everyone who disagrees with him, or am I mistaken?

José, good evening. Yes, I did write that about Meretz, Mapam, Labour, Kadima or indeed the New Israel Fund. But through all the postings here, you must have missed the bit about being a Herutnik or a Kahanist. It's an easy mistake to make, even to someone of your great intellect.

And you have the bare faced gall to accuse anyone of name calling !!!!

Mr. Telegramsam, "One doesn't have to be a Herutnik or a Kahanist to be a Zionist. One can support Meretz, Mapam, Labour, Kadima or indeed the New Israel Fund."

That's OK for people living IN Israel; they have the right to decide how to run themselves.

However, the problems begin inside Israel when people like Beilin start taking to problems outside to the world. And for Jews living abroad who declare themselves to be Zionists - definition: The Land of Isarel is the Home of the Jewish people - things are not so simple.

Davis really had a collossal chuztpah (which BTW, proves his Jewishness) in claiming that what Israel did should conform with what is convenient for him in exile; Jews outside of Israel are limited in how much they can openly criticize Israel; how much limited is the point of discussion - self-discipline and loyalty just isn't working here.

For these reasons, I would say that all the parties you mentioned above are "valid", except for the last one, which is not officially elected by Israelis, (maybe a tiny minority support them), they provided much information to Goldstone, which was very damaging to Israel, and which officially accuses Israel of "Occupation", which denudes Israel of responding to non-Jews who utter similar accusations.

I would say to people who don't support the Government of Israel's policies AND who don't live in Israel: "leave us alone and go about your business. If you aren't part of the solution, at least don't be part of the problem".

We can see jandrsimonson's dedicate a full post to ad hominem. After confusing cause and correlation, that is a lot!

And anyway Antho....I mean " jose "

That was reported to the JC moderator.

Oh I forgot you are a native French speaqker maybe that explains your problems with English

I am ready to bet I have less trouble with English than you have with French.
And anyway, I manage to be understood by most. Maybe you have some trouble with English. But in your case, I think the problem is more general. It's comprehension-impairment.

The solution to the "leadersheep" is simple: vote out the cowards and make sure they don't come back. Make sure the next leader will voice out loud the opinion of the community and its steadfast support of Israel.
Can it be less than the support expressed by Harper and Aznar?

But through all the postings here, you must have missed the bit about being a Herutnik or a Kahanist.

Again, you failed to mention Israel Beitenu and Likud. Maybe this fact escaped your less-than-half-wits.

o))

well precisely its that which is observed that is noticed or perceived not the observation or the seeing or perceiving

Still obfuscating? Don't try that on me or others it doesn't work.

And your permanent less-than-subliminal (your Oxford will tell you what that means) ad hominem message is of no interest here.

And you have the bare faced gall to accuse anyone of name calling !!!!

Not anyone, you. It is not an accusation. It is a fact, by the way: an observable fact. Oooops! I forgot your problems with the term "observation" (means something that can be seen, heard, etc.).

i'm observing " jose " surely you see it ?

o))

i'm observing " jose " surely you see it ?

How can I know what you might be looking at. I see several instances of "jose" on the same page. If you see only one, go to the closest ophtalmologist. If it still doesn't work after that, that is the comprehension-impairment again, and that cannot be corrected.

well yes there is always at least several instances of " jose " one the same page usually a lot more than several.I take your point. I seem to recall..........but lets not go there

"I am ready to bet I have less trouble with English than you have with French."

To say nothing of logical and unbiased thinking.

"Maybe this fact escaped your less-than-half-wits."

Please! I have a trademark on that :)))

I seem to recall..........but lets not go there

Too late. You went there. It was reported. You'll finish with your alter ego Ibrahim al-Rais. LOL!

went where " jose " ?

went where " jose " ?

I understand that you don't even understand what you write. You're just a nasty fly, wasting adult's time here.

Please! I have a trademark on that :)))

From now on, I shall include the required "(TM)"...

To say nothing of logical and unbiased thinking.

"caviar lefties" live in their bublle. They don't need to think, searching only bandwagon's approval.

Now you have gotten me all confused about what a leftie is. I had alwys uderstood left/right to refer to different positions concerning the ownership of the means of production/distribution and the relative sizes of the state and private sectors ec etc

I have yet to see any discussion of these issues on these blogs yet there seems to be a lot of lefties about,so clealy I have misunderstood. Help me out ?

What is a leftie ?

Simosnon, as usual, can't keep up.

These days, it's someone who jumps into bed with Islamists/jihadists/antisemites/neanderthal clerical fascists.

Jandrsimonson:

Bad people make enemies of the Jews.

I stand with the Jews.

For the love of God wake up.

Matt, that's very true and profound, of course. Sometimes, some Jews, make friends with bad people too. Such as those who march with Hizbollah and Hamas proxies or stand with the neo-Nazi thugs of the BNP/EDL.

That would be the EDL that has a representative on these blogs whose views you never challenge?

"Silence is admission" telegramsam, and that makes you a hypocrite.

"caviar leftie", not leftie. Still trying to obfuscate, aren't you?
No, there are not a "lot of lefties", otherwise they would have kept a majority in the Parliament, wouldn't they. But there are even less "caviar lefties", the kind of which we see here, judging Jerusalem with one standard of peace-striken European nation, and Ramallah with a standard for thirld-world dictatorship.

And double standards are a sure sign of antisemitism.

Matt, I'm sorry but you seem to have missed clashes between myself and the BNP/EDL people here. It's an easy mistake to make, what with all the to-ing and fro-ing in the posts here.

Please provide a link to these clashes telegramsam, I am unaware of them.

Aw, c'mon t'sam, knock it off already - you know that the lady sidled up to the gentleman and not vice versa.

Yvetta, I'm sorry, but I didn't mean that photo, or indeed those people, but thank you for reminding me. I meant Ufara Bat-Ashera, who appears to have left us.

No but you did post the photo and you did hound Jonathan about it for weeks, from behind your poisonous pseudonym, while apparently giving Ufara Bat-Ashera a free pass.

"Silence is admission", which I presume to mean that you agree with the EDL's divisive nature but used them as an excuse to attack Jonathan Hoffman.