Antisemitism? What antisemitism?

Yet again you show that you do not accept the EUMC Definition of Antisemitism.

Do you also not accept that the day is divided into 24 hours?

http://www.thejc.com/blogpost/zf-co-vice-chair-blasts-boards-macavity-jc...

Great article by Stephen Pollard!

No one accepts the EUMC (now non-existent) Working Definition of anti-Semitism. And why the self-promotion, Jonathan?
Britain, if anything, is probably one of the least antisemitic countries. The author Pollard is praising, Baroness Ruth Deech, would hardly have reached her positions, a former head of an Oxford college, BBC governor and chair of the Human Fertilisation & Embryology Authority, and now a crossbencher in the House of Lords, if antisemitism was prevalent.
Let's consider the evidence. No other non-Christian denomination has its leader sitting in the Lords like Lord Sacks and his late predecessor, Lord Jakobovits.
Every year, the Oxford Dictionary of National Biography publishes an online supplement of new entries of persons deceased five years earlier. In recent years, between six and ten per cent of all them entries were Jewish. Out of a total of one-half of one per cent of the entire population.
Six of the 24 current members of the Order of Merit are Jewish, as have been three of the five most recent Lord Chief Justices.
You are far more likely to face discrimination if you are Asian or Afro-Caribbean.

Moshe is confusing the issue. Yes, some criticism of Israel is quite distinct from anti-semitism - but more and more, such criticism is simply a vehicle for anti-semitism of one kind or another. Else, why the double standards? Eg buy Israeli goods and you risk the wrath of the boycott brigade. They're quite happy for you to buy (say) Chinese goods: maybe the Tibetans just aren't as photogenic as the Palestinians.
OK, Britain is still a good country for Jews to live, in my view. But the extremism on campus and so forth is worrying - and a lot of it is motivated by plain and simple Jew-hatred.
To see anti-semitism everywhere is paranoid. To see it nowhere, as Moshe seems to, is naive.

What double standards, David? There's a boycott of Chinese goods, too, if you haven't noticed. It seems to me that for some people, the word Israel jumps out at them in every instance, for good and for bad. Where the criticism of Israel is anti-Semitic, it should be noted as such. But where it is merely criticism of its expansionist policies, it ain't anti-Semitism.

Moshe, please take a look at the comments on this blog post in the Telegraph.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/nilegardiner/100030542/barack-obama-tr...

I am not Jewish, but I am extremely offended and worried by such open Jew hatred. It makes me want to cry. I find it deeply and utterly wrong. And I've spent enough time debating the situation in Israel with people on discussion boards to know that these kinds of viewpoints always surface eventually. And then people complain about being called anti-Semites. Duh.

"But where it is merely criticism of its expansionist policies, it ain't anti-Semitism."

Israel doesn't have an expansionist policies Moshe. Reading people accusing such a small country of expansionism just makes me shake my head in wonder.

Israel is not trying to conquer the Arab world. Israel just wants secure defined borders and to be able to defend its citizens from attacks. That's all.

Israel does have expansionist policies, Matt. Just look at the continued settlement building on the West Bank and in East Jerusalem. That's what will be the death of Israel, not a few silly blog comments.

Moshe, please compare Israel's borders on independence from the British with the borders it has now. If it makes you feel better you can include the West Bank and Gaza Strip in its current territories.

How much bigger is Israel now Moshe?

It is much bigger than 1948 and includes territory with a population that makes it an apartheid state. So, yes, Israel does have expansionist policies.

Moshe you seem to be dimensionally challenged. Perhaps you are getting confused between bigger and smaller.

I asked you about the relative sizes between declaration of independence (which was before Egypt and Jordan took 50% of the country - including the Jewish Quarter in Jerusalem - and expelled the Jewish populations) and today.

Do you want me to draw some maps for you? Will that help? :)

Egypt and Jordan took nothing of Israel, since the West Bank, East Jerusalem, Gaza and the Golan were never designated as part of the Jewish state.
In fact, if we go back to the partition of 1947, the Jewish state should actually be just the area between Hadera and Gadera and perhaps a little bit of the Negev and Galil.
So between the declaration of Independence and now, Israel has added the West Bank, Gaza Strip and Golan Heights to its territory, including the 5 million or so non-Jews therein.

That would be the UN partition plan that the Yishuv agreed to but surrounding Arab states rejected? Care to tell us why that was Moshe?

Are you denying the existence of Jewish communities in Judea & Samara, Jerusalem and Gaza prior to the 1948 war Moshe? Are you legitimising the wholesale ethnic cleansing which took place during and following the invasion of those territories?

Your heart obviously bleeds for the "non-Jews" which you talk about, which shows that you are a great humanitarian. Care to tell us your feelings about the 900,000 Jews that were kicked out of surrounding Arab countries in that war?

You must be aware that when Jordan and Egypt (and Syria, Iraq and Lebanon) invaded in 1948 the stated aim was to eradicate the entire country and replace it with an Arab governed state?

Tell us Moshe, if you had been around in 1948 would you have supported Israel or the invading Arab countries?

The yishuv accepted the 1947 boundaries. Great. So let Israel go back to them.

Moshe your complete lack of understanding for the Israeli point of view is astonishing.

Come on and tell us, what's your agenda mate?

Why do you spend so much time on this website attacking Israel?

And please answer my questions above.

And you are, Matt? Do I owe you or anyone else anything? No? Didn't think so. Mate.

I'll tell you my agenda, I don't make a secret of it.

I'm a UK citizen who supports Israel as a small democratic country, filled with nice people who just want to get on with their lives. Like most UK citizens I've tended to avoid getting involved in the conflict, but since Operation Cast Lead I feel that I have no choice but to side with Israel and Israel's supporters in the UK - mainly due to the nasty, vicious, hateful nature of Israel's enemies here that think destruction of property, intimidation and attacks on the police are an acceptable way to express their views.

And frankly, you seem to spend an inordinate amount of time bashing Israel on this site, you use abusive and intimidatory language against other posters who disagree with you, and your choice of attacks (apartheid, racist, expansionist) are uncompromising and completely lacking in any kind of empathy for your fellow human beings or the problems that they face.

Matt, if you can show me where I have been abusive, I promise to change my ways. But I haven't called any one names. Nor I have called any one a liar (or lier as he likes to spell it). I express my views forcefully because I believe that Israel has betrayed Jews by becoming apartheid, racist and expansionist. That's my agenda. Mate.

Moshe you have allowed yourself to be seduced by the lies and sedition of Israel's mortal enemies, many of whom just want to see dead Jews. One day your words will come back to haunt you, because things are likely to get very nasty for Israelis and for people that have the courage to support them over the next few years.

Who is betraying whom?

Israel is betraying mainly itself, Matt.

You're wrong. Israel is trying to survive in the face of relentless hostility, violence and deceit.

How can you in good conscience accuse them of treachery when you live in such safety and it is them that are under constant threat of attack?

Give them a bloody break and stop judging them, and try helping them. They have enough enemies, why do you insist on adding yourself to the list?

Sorry to disabuse you, Matt, but Israel is its own worst enemy.

No need to apologise Moshe, you're still wrong.

Israel is a model of how a civilised country should behave when under relentless attack. Show me one country that has behaved with such patience and humanity to enemies who show them nothing but hatred and rejection. In all of history.

I would be proud to call myself Jewish, if I was, and I am proud to support Israel against all the bigots and haters in the world.

And you, Moshe, know not what harm you do.

This shit costs lives.

With respect, quite a lot of what the conflict Israel has brought upon itself. That's why you are wrong.

Conflicts have two sides Moshe. War is nasty, and people don't always behave in the manner that we'd like them to. Again, don't judge until you're in that position.

The Middle East conflict is not a game, it's deadly serious. With Iran and Hamas in the equation it's not a case of "two peoples living in harmony". It's zero sum. One side will win, one will lose. If Israel loses it will be the end of Israel and the end of the Jewish presence in the region. And probably every other religion that isn't Islam.

If you side with Iran and Hamas, then that's your prerogative. If you support Israel, then my advice is that you start acting like it. If you're ambivalent, then to be honest you should keep your opinions to yourself because what you say here influences people and has direct consequences.

To be honest, and despite the fact that you are the best wicketkeeper this country has had in years, matt, I don't side with any one. They are all as bad as each other in so many ways and on so many levels.